Witchcraft 'n Wicca

[headheart]

Ocean View.jpg

What's it all about?

Some years ago, I wrote a book about 'Witchcraft'. That was before Wikipedia Online Encyclopedia, and so I pretty much read what I had in my book shelf, and what I could get from the Internet, and then did my very best.

Around about the same time, I met a Wiccan, and as we sat outside with a marvellous view of the ocean below us, we eventually got around to talking about our very different beliefs. I discovered that my ideas about Wicca and Witchcraft were seriously flawed, and visa versa.

As I have set myself the task of re-writing the book, I was wondering if anyone would be interested in directing me to a book, which you believe best explains a) Witchcraft, and b) the Wiccan Religion, or both.

Or, of course, you can just break it down, over as many comments as you deem necessary. (keep in mind the forum rules about the limit to the length of quotes, etcetera.)

[St Croix]

To your question of "what is all about" I suggest it is ultimately about serving one's own will. Thy will is the divine will. To serve your will. and to get others to serve your will, is the end. Everything else, rites, rituals, gods and goddesses, are the means to that end. It is implicit that one's own will is not perceived as subservient to the will of the Deity, whose existence is denied, and knowledge of which is forbidden to be inculcated lest it inferfere with the doing of one's own will.

As for the difference between Wicca and Witchcraft, I have no idea, but strongly suspect that if there is one, it is not worth knowing.

[headheart]

To your question of "what is all about" I suggest it is ultimately about serving one's own will. Thy will is the divine will. To serve your will. and to get others to serve your will, is the end. Everything else, rites, rituals, gods and goddesses, are the means to that end. It is implicit that one's own will is not perceived as subservient to the will of the Deity, whose existence is denied, and knowledge of which is forbidden to be inculcated lest it inferfere with the doing of one's own will.

Thanks for replying to my post.

I've invested some time in having open discussions with Pagans, Shaman, Wiccans and bona-fida seekers. Suffice to say the experience was rather enlightening.

I've also read quite a few articles by Herne @ Celtic Connection in the past and it helped to sweep away some of the confusion.

As for the difference between Wicca and Witchcraft, I have no idea, but strongly suspect that if there is one, it is not worth knowing.

Here are some very brief descriptions of Wicca, Pagan and Witchcraft - It's all copyrighted so I cannot cut 'n paste them here. You will also find complete essays covering the subject of Wicca and Witchcraft and in particular an essay titled 'What is Wicca?.' I know that when I read it some years ago, I was quite surprised at how many of my own preconception where swept away.

In short, it's all about seeking. (or would that be sweeping )

[shunyadragon]

I consider Wicca, witch craft, paganism and other related beliefs to represent a spectrum of beliefs that are quite variable from belief to belief and even among individuals that try to return to 'ancient ways.' I try to view them from an objective view as possible. I believe it is an effort to return to a form of nature reverence worship where the attributes of the Divine are expressed in nature with as rocks, trees, bodies of water, and elements of animism. The primal elements of earth, fire, water and air are important to many, with some including wood. It is common for many to believe in Celtic and Druidic traditions, and supposed recreations of ceremonies. of belief, and in the British Isles develop ceremonial traditions around ancient monuments like the Stone Hinge.

Some I see sincere efforts at returned to ancient ways of nature reverence and worship, but in many I see it as rebellion against establishment religions, which I agree in principle, but they most often try to create an ideal of a lost ancient primal past that no longer exists, like Gilgamesh trying to resurrect Enkido the manifestation of his primal self, who gave his life so that Gilgamesh could live.

I have discussions in the past concerning this, and I may dig them up and come up with references for you.

[headheart]

I consider Wicca, witch craft, paganism and other related beliefs to represent a spectrum of beliefs that are quite variable from belief to belief and even among individuals that try to return to 'ancient ways.' I try to view them from an objective view as possible. I believe it is an effort to return to a form of nature reverence worship where the attributes of the Divine are expressed in nature with as rocks, trees, bodies of water, and elements of animism. The primal elements of earth, fire, water and air are important to many, with some including wood. It is common for many to believe in Celtic and Druidic traditions, and supposed recreations of ceremonies. of belief, and in the British Isles develop ceremonial traditions around ancient monuments like the Stone Hinge.

Some I see sincere efforts at returned to ancient ways of nature reverence and worship, but in many I see it as rebellion against establishment religions, which I agree in principle, but they most often try to create an ideal of a lost ancient primal past that no longer exists, like Gilgamesh trying to resurrect Enkido the manifestation of his primal self, who gave his life so that Gilgamesh could live.

I have discussions in the past concerning this, and I may dig them up and come up with references for you.

Thanks for the attempt at a summary of ideas which differ considerably between Wicca (Kinds of) and Witchcraft. I'd suggest you read some of the articles referenced here ( and in my last comment) if you'd like to gain greater insight. btw. It's Stonehenge, not Stone Hinge.

A spot of WOE for you:

Stonehenge is a prehistoric monument located in the English county of Wiltshire, about 2.0 miles (3.2 km) west of Amesbury and 8 miles (13 km) north of Salisbury. One of the most famous sites in the world, Stonehenge is composed of a circular setting of large standing stones set within earthworks. It is at the centre of the most dense complex of Neolithic and Bronze Age monuments in England, including several hundred burial mounds. ( "Stonehenge World Heritage Site Management Plan". UNESCO: 18. July 2008. )

Here's a common enough question: Are Wicca and Witchcraft the same thing?

Answer (from the same place linked in my previous comment) :

Some say yes, and some say no. I suppose the only way to navigate this question safely is to point out what some may consider the main differences. In general, Wiccans feel free to review different belief systems, such as Celtic, Norse, Essene, Gnosis, or Shamanism, and then blend together any points that "feel" right into their own personal path. Pure Witchcraft on the other hand, may focus a little more tightly on using Magick and ritual to work with the elemental and spiritual forces in nature. Regardless, I feel the differences are slight in that Wicca and Witchcraft both work to achieve balance and harmony within nature and self.

Personally, I follow a predominately Celtic Witch/Tantric path. As time passes, I find myself increasingly drawing upon the wisdom and beliefs of other spiritual paths as my knowledge and understanding of them increases. So, when asked I'll tell you I'm a Witch, I also consider myself a Wiccan and perhaps part Shaman because I utilize and blend aspects of them all.

To read more frequently asked questions: here

Perhaps I should have asked that only those who are actual witches reply ? Let's do it that way, then. Okay?

Peace,
headheart

[Durthorin]

Merry Meet.

Can I ask what the purposes of your book is? A number of books have been written by pagans for pagans and for people who are not of our faith making attempts to explain portions of it. You will understand that having seen my faith misrepresented on multiple occasions I am somewhat loath to assist.

[headheart]

Merry Meet.

Can I ask what the purposes of your book is? A number of books have been written by pagans for pagans and for people who are not of our faith making attempts to explain portions of it. You will understand that having seen my faith misrepresented on multiple occasions I am somewhat loath to assist.

Oh, I understand perfectly. I started out writing my book with MANY preconceptions and I want to set the record straight by writing a substantive retraction of my first work. I'm currently studying something completely unrelated, but I'd like to get some input from those who are willing to read my really bad first attempt and giving me some serious criticism.

This blog page will hook you up to how far along I've got.

There are four links on this page the first which will take you to my first attempt: (some time back so pleas excuse my naivete ) the remainder are my attempts are moving to a more enlightened approach to this:

http://aerycksmusic.wordpress.com/20...-practitioner/

No harm.
Eric.

[headheart]

I've requested a permanent banning to allow me to get on with my life, study and research.

Peace to y'all for the awesome exchanges, though hot and furious at time always a spicy meatball of flames that makes the tummy to rumble.

Journey safe.

headheart.

Walking ForwARD.jpg

[shunyadragon]

Thanks for the attempt at a summary of ideas which differ considerably between Wicca (Kinds of) and Witchcraft. I'd suggest you read some of the articles referenced here ( and in my last comment) if you'd like to gain greater insight. btw. It's Stonehenge, not Stone Hinge.

A spot of WOE for you:

I apologize for slips in spelling, but yes I am very familiar with Stonehenge and the recent research concerning its use and origins. Contemporary rituals, cerimonies and explanations of the monument by Wicca and Pagan movements are made up.

Here's a common enough question: Are Wicca and Witchcraft the same thing?

Answer (from the same place linked in my previous comment) :



Perhaps I should have asked that only those who are actual witches reply ? Let's do it that way, then. Okay?

Peace,
headheart

I believe my original post describes this problem well. There is no specific distinction, and so many varieties from Native American to Celtic efforts to recreate a past paradigm.

[headheart]

I apologize for slips in spelling <snip>

No harm.

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These days all one has to do is Google it, bra.

1. Wikipedia Online Encyclopedia > Wicca ( Check the Bibliography for further study )
2. You Tube: Wicca?
or, you could ask a Wiccan: 3. Wicca Forums < the best option.

Research is fine as an academic pursuit but one can often get trapped in "generalizations" with regard to beliefs and this is especially true with Wiccans. If you want to learn about Wiccan beliefs, Frank, talk to a Wiccan. I did and it changed my way of thinking and also how I am rewriting my earlier effort.


Would You Believe - Wicca Ways - Part 1 Part 2 Part 3

Bye-bye,
headheart

[shunyadragon]

No harm.

Photograph.png

These days all one has to do is Google it, bra.

1. Wikipedia Online Encyclopedia > Wicca ( Check the Bibliography for further study )
2. You Tube: Wicca?
or, you could ask a Wiccan: 3. Wicca Forums < the best option.

Research is fine as an academic pursuit but one can often get trapped in "generalizations" with regard to beliefs and this is especially true with Wiccans. If you want to learn about Wiccan beliefs, Frank, talk to a Wiccan. I did and it changed my way of thinking and also how I am rewriting my earlier effort.


Would You Believe - Wicca Ways - Part 1 Part 2 Part 3

Bye-bye,
headheart

I have talked to a number of Wiccan believers and believers of related faiths. They are common where I lived in West Virginia and around North Carolina. Thee is a variety of beliefs, but many appear to practice a nature worship thing with strong humanist beliefs and a mix of goddesses and mythical preoccupations. It is common for them to practice astrology and fortune telling.

[Durthorin]

I have talked to a number of Wiccan believers and believers of related faiths. They are common where I lived in West Virginia and around North Carolina. Thee is a variety of beliefs, but many appear to practice a nature worship thing with strong humanist beliefs and a mix of goddesses and mythical preoccupations. It is common for them to practice astrology and fortune telling.

Divination, runes, tarot is to many pagans a form of prayer or a ritual to seek guidance from the Gods, on a secular level the act of taking and issue or problem to cards or stones forces you to look at the problem from a different perspective. We find it useful. As for astrology, I have found about the same number of Pagans who really believe in it about the same as nonPagans.

Blessed Be, Dur.

[shunyadragon]

Divination, runes, tarot is to many pagans a form of prayer or a ritual to seek guidance from the Gods, on a secular level the act of taking and issue or problem to cards or stones forces you to look at the problem from a different perspective. We find it useful. As for astrology, I have found about the same number of Pagans who really believe in it about the same as nonPagans.

Blessed Be, Dur.

Thanks for the clarification. I consider the Runes and Tarot cards to be fortune telling. An interesting side note is I found the Astrology among Wiccan to be different from the generic variety of Astrology found in the general population, In the general population it was mostly a loosely followed vanity game. Other than that I still do not know a lot about the Astrology they practice, just different.

My main impressions were that there is a diversity of beliefs, and no clear differntiation between what people call witchcraft and what is called wicca

[headheart]

My main impressions were that there is a diversity of beliefs, and no clear differntiation between what people call witchcraft and what is called wicca

Hi Frank.

A personal note:

In 1997-1998, I chanced to meet a maid who claimed to be a Wiccan, and with each question I asked, I realized that I'd assembled my ideas based on hearsay. In the end, I felt like a diminished elephant in jewelry store.

According to the Pagan Connection:

Wicca is a '....modern Pagan religion with spiritual roots in the earliest expressions of reverence for nature. Some major identifying motifs are: reverence for both the Goddess and God; acceptance of reincarnation and magick; ritual observance of astronomical and agricultural phenomena; and the use of magickal circles for ritual purposes.'

Whereas Witchcraft is the '....craft of the witch - magick, especially magick utilizing personal power in conjunction with the energies within stones, herbs, colors, and other natural objects. This belief system also has nothing to do with Satanism.

From: Definitions of Wicca, Pagan & Witchcraft @ The Celtic Connection, wicca.com

[Skyfire]

As for the difference between Wicca and Witchcraft, I have no idea, but strongly suspect that if there is one, it is not worth knowing.

Wicca is a belief system, Witchcraft is a practice. Most Wiccans practice Witchcraft, but you can be a Wiccan without practicing Witchcraft, and you can practice Witchcraft without being a Wiccan.

And everything is worth knowing. You don't have to agree with what you learn, but knowledge is power - the power to choose.