If life begins as conception, what about miscarriages?

[Pitchforkpat]

You don't believe anyone has a soul,

I don’t know what a “soul” is. Please define “soul” for me and tell me what proof you have that there is such a thing. Thank you.

Pat you are a soulless retard, but I still think you have a right to live

Good comeback, Sparko. Excellent apologetics

[Sparko]

I


Sparko, I’ll assume you’re not just avoiding this question and jus missed it, so here it is again:

Since you just told us we don’t know when a zygote attains personhood (life), the question is what right do YOU have to tell someone they can’t follow their conscience?

You are the one claiming personhood=life, Pat.

Explain to me the difference between a living human being and a person.

are you saying an embryo is not a human being?

When did your life begin, Pat?

[TimZim]

Thus, it's called 'irony'. Why are the self proclamed atheist, whining how mean God is when things go bad.

Okay, pixie pooh, I let you in a secret. Atheist don't believe a god exists, they don't think a god that doesn't exist is mean.

Rather when the comment about a mean nonexistent god, it is their way of making fun of you for being so dense. It is a more polite way of doing that than telling you that you're a mentally deficient halfwit if you believe the stupid fake-god story you tell people about.

Abortions and mischarage's are two differnet things,

Okay lilpixiepooh, is "mischarage" one of those Christopher Robbin's neighborhood words? If so, I will take your word for it.

Otherwise, abortion is a broad term that includes spontaneous abortions, which are commonly called, "miscarriages."

Second, where does the Bible say, that suffering will not happen?

huh? I didn't say nothing 'bout no sufferin', Miss Pixiepooh.

lots of fundy atheist ... whine that God doesn't do things, the way they want, so he doesn't exist.

see above

. Now are you done with the emotionalism or do you want to keep showing that you don't have a logical leg to stand on, so you'll appeal to emotions?

A little projection? I'm laid up in bed watching basketball all weekend, I feel close to emotionless. Though, I had a wee little smile when Pitino lost.

This is just an assertion and will be treated as such, until you actually provide a real argument.

Grrr. Maybe you're really lilpixieofTigger.

[Pitchforkpat]

Explain to me the difference between a living human being and a person

Ahhh, the old Sparko trick of refusing to answer questions and then trying to cover up by asking different questions.

Here are the questions you’ve refused to answer.

1. Since you just told us we don’t know when a zygote attains personhood (life), the question is what right do YOU have to tell someone they can’t follow their conscience?


2. You used the word “soul”. Please define “soul” for me and tell me what proof you have that there is such a thing?

Once you answer them, I’ll be happy to answer yours. I will take further refusal to answer as admission that you, in fact, can't answer them.

[Sparko]

Ahhh, the old Sparko trick of refusing to answer questions and then trying to cover up by asking different questions.

Here are the questions you’ve refused to answer.




Once you answer them, I’ll be happy to answer yours. I will take further refusal to answer as admission that you, in fact, can't answer them.

no. it is you who is refusing to answer the questions. I used the term "human being" in my argument.

So since you keep saying Person=Life, it is up to you to answer the questions first. Or are you afraid?

Here are the questions again, if you are not afraid to answer:

What is the difference between a living human being and a person?

are you saying an embryo is not a human being?

When did your life begin, Pat?

[lilpixieofterror]

I


Sparko, I’ll assume you’re not just avoiding this question and jus missed it, so here it is again:

Since you just told us we don’t know when a zygote attains personhood (life), the question is what right do YOU have to tell someone they can’t follow their conscience?

Yet again, the endless question game in which pitch-a-fit ask endless questions, to try to get answers out so he can troll with. Now we are on step 5 I see...

[Sparko]

Yet again, the endless question game in which pitch-a-fit ask endless questions, to try to get answers out so he can troll with. Now we are on step 5 I see...

exactly, especially since I never said I "don't know when a zygote attains personhood (life)" - that's just his strawman.

[lilpixieofterror]

Okay, pixie pooh, I let you in a secret. Atheist don't believe a god exists, they don't think a god that doesn't exist is mean.

Awe, trying to act all smart and showing that you're just a humorless troll, that is here for my own personal amusement??

Rather when the comment about a mean nonexistent god, it is their way of making fun of you for being so dense. It is a more polite way of doing that than telling you that you're a mentally deficient halfwit if you believe the stupid fake-god story you tell people about.

Watch the stupid troll avoid the irony in the fundy atheist world view and, yet again, show the world how stupid he really is. It's rather easy, if God doesn't exist, suffering is meaningless and so are questions to people who believe there is a God. What does it matter what they believe? We will all die and the worle will end, so what does it matter? It's easy, the fundy atheist is obessed with something that doesn't exist and spends hours and hours, asking endless questions, about why a God doesn't end suffering, when their own beliefs tell them that all of life is meaningless anyway. As for the 'mentally deficient halfwit' part, that's pretty funny, since I'm a supervisor for 12 people and they look to me, to make decisions about what we need to do next. It takes quite a bit of intelligence and know how, to be able to do that. How about you Tim, what do you do on a daily bases or is trolling Christians, your own real accomplishment?

Okay lilpixiepooh, is "mischarage" one of those Christopher Robbin's neighborhood words? If so, I will take your word for it.

Notice the avoidance and instead picking on spelling errors because the little fundy atheist, can't answer the argument because it exposes his argument for the emotional crap trap, it really is.. Guess this is what happens, when you are over your head and stalling for answers.

Otherwise, abortion is a broad term that includes spontaneous abortions, which are commonly called, "miscarriages."

Maybe on the third definition, but I guess you never took English 101 in college and learned that words carry a definition meaning (such as definition 3 or 4, which you are using) and it carries a social or emotional meaning (which is related to abortions commonly done by some so called 'doctors', for the sake of convience). This is known as connotation vs dennotation because words have a dictionary definition and will often have an emotional or social attachment, to go along with it (like the term retard, while once used as a technical definition, it now carries negative meaning with it and that is why there's more of a switch in the medical world to use 'diability' instead of 'retarded', even though both words, carry similar definitions, in medical speak). Despite your belief that theist are brain dead and bairly can think, I know how to spot emotional charging of words because I have taken writing classes too and know how to spot emotional charging. Go ahead and try to play stupid, but I know better.

huh? I didn't say nothing 'bout no sufferin', Miss Pixiepooh.

Yet, you ask why mischarages happen and can't see the link between suffering and mischarages and how this argument is simply another 'problem of evil' argument and thus, can be answered the same way. Yep, dumb as ever.

see above

Yep, still too dumb to see it, eh?

A little projection? I'm laid up in bed watching basketball all weekend, I feel close to emotionless. Though, I had a wee little smile when Pitino lost.

Nah, projection would only be true, if it was true projection, but I am pretty relaxed myself after the wonderful morning I have nor do I let little trolls like you, upset me. It is funny though, to watch you condemn DE for 'reading your thoughts', and then you try to the very thing you condemn. Always great to watch fundy atheist, who think they are above the rules and standards, they hold others to. Do tell me why it is wrong for DE to do something you are now doing to me?

Grrr. Maybe you're really lilpixieofTigger.

Or maybe you're just stupid, either one, you show, yet again, why you are already a laughing stock around here. How long did it take you, a week?

[lilpixieofterror]

exactly, especially since I never said I "don't know when a zygote attains personhood (life)" - that's just his strawman.

Of course it is because personhood and life, would be two different things. My dog isn't a person, but is still alive. Think he knows the difference between the two?

[TimZim]

I don't recall any theists arguing abortion is wrong because a zygote or fetus (you do know there is a difference right?) has a soul. We have been arguing that it is immoral to take an innocent human life.

Our arguments against abortion are not theist in nature at all, Even atheists can agree it is immoral to take an innocent human life, no matter what stage of development it is in, or where it is located.

The crux of the debate has been the same for years. Specifically is a zygote or fetus a distinct human life, or a different kind/category of life?

When Christian argue that they are "babies," they almost always use religious language to explain why they believe that.

[Sparko]

The crux of the debate has been the same for years. Specifically is a zygote or fetus a distinct human life, or a different kind/category of life?

what do you think? Is a human zygote a human life or not? If not what kind of life is it?

When Christian argue that they are "babies," they almost always use religious language to explain why they believe that.

I don't recall anyone in the threads we have both been in doing so. Perhaps you could point out an example?

[TimZim]

:

Maybe on the third definition, but I guess you never took English 101 in college and learned that words carry a definition meaning (such as definition 3 or 4, which you are using) and it carries a social or emotional meaning (which is related to abortions commonly done by some so called 'doctors', for the sake of convience).

Every, well, "abortion" is called an abortion in medical books, and in medical literature, and in the way medical professionals communicate with each other.

It is easier to do this, just as it is with other instances.

For example, it is easier for me to say you have aborted reason and logic in this thread.
It would be presumptuous for me to assume this was "elective" abortion, or due to some mental disorder, "spontaneous" abortion.

[phaedrus]

what do you think? Is a human zygote a human life or not? If not what kind of life is it?

I don't recall anyone in the threads we have both been in doing so. Perhaps you could point out an example?

I think a human zygote is human life in a similar (but not identical way) to a single skin cell from your arm. I wouldn't classify it as a human being though since it hasn't a differentiated cell structure, a nervous system or consciousness. It is an interesting question and people will have different answers.

You all may now feel free to call stupid, an atheist troll and a fundy atheist.

[Hamster]

Everyone remain calm. The thread seems to be passing through an alternate dimension where straw men rule over flesh and red herring stalk the earth.

You seem to be making up your own religion as you go along

Right. Christian tradition doesn't say anything about hades, the grave, sheol, purgatory, the lake of fire, seventh heaven, paradise, etc.

That alternate religion of yours is coming along.

How is that speculation an 'alternate religion' when I don't believe it and was just proposing it as a hypothetical? Also it wouldn't be part of the religion if something like that wasn't revealed yet. It simply dismantles the conclusion of your false dilemma. At least, the conclusion that you imply with patronizing innuendo in lieu of actually defending a concrete position. The statement doesn't have to be true, only possible. And of course a billion other things are possible.

hey could be less joyful and blissful as the rest of humanity

The issue isn't what God wants them to experience but what they have the capacity to experience. Of course that was one of a billion alternatives that are possible but unknown.

"They either go to heaven or hell? " is a false dilemma because it assumes only heaven and hell exist (rumors say Earth and the rest of the universe exist to) and that we have to choose between suffering torment and absolute euphoria in hell or heaven respectively. But I await the new round of flaccid bellyaching.

[lilpixieofterror]

Every, well, "abortion" is called an abortion in medical books, and in medical literature, and in the way medical professionals communicate with each other.

That's nice and this is a popular web site, that uses popular language and the term 'abortion' has a connotation attached to it or do you not understand that?

It is easier to do this, just as it is with other instances.

Not really, but whatever.

For example, it is easier for me to say you have aborted reason and logic in this thread.
It would be presumptuous for me to assume this was "elective" abortion, or due to some mental disorder, "spontaneous" abortion.

Or you could simply say 'miscarriage', which means the same thing, but hey... emotionalism is better then logic, eh?