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Mark 1, "Son of God"

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  • Mark 1, "Son of God"

    Mark 1: The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

    Question: Is "the Son of God" supposed to be in Mark 1, or was it added later?

    Thanks.

  • #2
    Do you have any evidence either way, or are you just spitballing?
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
    sigpic
    I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

    Comment


    • #3
      It is my understanding only one of the 4th century oldest mss omits it. Of the all the Greek mss that omit "Son of God" only 00.8 % of the mss. Of which 98.8 % of all the mss have the reading "Son of God." Including 4th and 5th century mss.
      . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

      . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

      Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by 37818 View Post
        It is my understanding only one of the 4th century oldest mss omits it. Of the all the Greek mss that omit "Son of God" only 00.8 % of the mss. Of which 98.8 % of all the mss have the reading "Son of God." Including 4th and 5th century mss.
        Thank you very much.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
          Do you have any evidence either way, or are you just spitballing?
          I'm just trying to keep up with someone who LOVES Bart Erhman -- a Muslim, of course.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Christian3 View Post
            I'm just trying to keep up with someone who LOVES Bart Erhman -- a Muslim, of course.
            Ah, ok. Much ado about nothing, then. It's not as if that's the only location the phrase is found.
            Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

            Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
            sigpic
            I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
              Ah, ok. Much ado about nothing, then. It's not as if that's the only location the phrase is found.
              I pointed that out. We have to take the New Testament as a whole and Jesus being "the Son of God" is noted elsewhere in the New Testament.

              Is there any update on this?

              http://www.dts.edu/read/wallace-new-...first-century/

              Clip:

              Dr. Wallace: Earliest Manuscript of the New Testament Discovered?

              These new papyri will no doubt continue that trend. But, if this Mark fragment is confirmed as from the first century, what a thrill it will be to have a manuscript that is dated within the lifetime of many of the eyewitnesses to Jesus’ resurrection!

              Thanks.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Christian3 View Post
                I pointed that out. We have to take the New Testament as a whole and Jesus being "the Son of God" is noted elsewhere in the New Testament.

                Is there any update on this?

                http://www.dts.edu/read/wallace-new-...first-century/

                Clip:

                Dr. Wallace: Earliest Manuscript of the New Testament Discovered?

                These new papyri will no doubt continue that trend. But, if this Mark fragment is confirmed as from the first century, what a thrill it will be to have a manuscript that is dated within the lifetime of many of the eyewitnesses to Jesus’ resurrection!

                Thanks.
                I haven't seen any update. It is important to keep in mind that this will not be anything like a complete manuscript, but I agree - any first-century NT fragments would be big news.
                Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                sigpic
                I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                Comment


                • #9
                  Not a single citation to check the information against: Making an assessment on that sort of basis is kind of difficult.
                  1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
                  .
                  ⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
                  Scripture before Tradition:
                  but that won't prevent others from
                  taking it upon themselves to deprive you
                  of the right to call yourself Christian.

                  ⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Christian3 View Post
                    Mark 1: The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

                    Question: Is "the Son of God" supposed to be in Mark 1, or was it added later?

                    Thanks.
                    It's debated as to whether or not it's a later addition.

                    https://www.jstor.org/stable/2463786...n_tab_contents

                    It's omitted by Origen in the third century, but Irenaeus makes reference to it in the second.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by psstein View Post
                      It's debated as to whether or not it's a later addition.

                      https://www.jstor.org/stable/2463786...n_tab_contents

                      It's omitted by Origen in the third century, but Irenaeus makes reference to it in the second.
                      Right. If it were just one manuscript, I don't think there would be any question. Unfortunately it's a bit more than that. The evidence for omission is still not overwhelming, and many critical translations (e.g. NRSV) include it. Here's what the Word commentary says:

                      "“Son of God” (νἱοῦ θεοῦ) is missing in א* Θ 28 sypal Irengr,lat1/3 Orgr,lat but present in א1 B D L W pc latt sy co; Irenlat2 (A reads νἱοῦ τοῦ θεοῦ). Though broadly and strongly attested, its omission in several MSS provides basis for question. The internal argument favors the reading (cf. Pesch, 1:74, n. 1; Slomp, BT 28 [1977] 143–50). Not only does the evangelist use the title to introduce Jesus in 1:11 but the Roman centurion’s recognition of Jesus as “Son of God” in 15:39 offers the climactic counterpart of that revelation (cf. 1:11; 5:7; 9:7; 14:61). Although a homoioteleuton at the beginning of a work seems unusual (Slomp, BT 28 [1977] 148), the series of six genitives and the normally abbreviated ΙΤ ΧΤ ΤΤ ΘΤ (Turner, JTS 26 [1925] 150) make this suggestion the best explanation for its absence."

                      Some commentaries say that this was regarded as the title, and titles were more subject to change than the rest of the text. Of course the question not theologically significant, since "son of God" is used elsewhere in Mark as a characteristic title for Jesus.

                      Comment

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