Ring the Bell

[lee_merrill]

Sir Oliver Lodge informs us that "men of culture are not bothering," nowadays, "about their sin, much less about their punishment," and Dr. Johnston Ross preaches us a much needed homily from that text on the "lightheartedness of the modern religious quest." (Benjamin B. Warfield)

Now I shall write about hell.

I have for the longest time been a universalist. Before you fall off your chair, or throw something at me (Oh, hell! It's Rob Bell) I first must clarify. I believe we are allowed to hope that all will repent. Being a Calvinist, I believe we repent by God's decision, our repentance is primarily due to his decree that we do so--so then I hope he will choose everyone. But I do not believe we should insist on that.

There are two positive cases, no three, in the Bible, one for eternal punishment, one for annihilation, and one for all being saved, and I believe they are all convincing.

So then to pick one, and insist that that's it, is I think irresponsible, and an injustice to Scripture. For who can deny "these will go into eternal punishment?" or "the smoke of their torment goes up to the ages of the ages"? Or "they will pay the penalty of everlasting destruction"? Or "Just as in Adam all die, so in Christ shall all be made alive"?

But I mention here only the injustice done by focusing on the grace of God and the love of God, and leaving off consideration of punishment. But "those whom we suffer to be betrayed by their worst enemies, their sins, will have just cause to curse us one day." (Richard Sibbes, "The Bruised Reed"). The Puritans were great on self-examination, perhaps too much so, but at least they investigated, and told us what they found there. Let us let Doctor Sibbes preach to us.

"How little encouragement will carry us to the affairs of this life! And yet all the helps God offers will hardly prevail with our backward natures."

"But this is the vanity of our natures, that though we shun above all things to be deceived and mistaken in present things, yet in the greatest matters of all we are willingly ignorant and misled."

"Therefore none are so aware of corruption as those whose souls are most alive." (Richard Sibbes, "The Bruised Reed")

Or sir Scougal:

"In a word, when I reflect on my highest and most specious attainments, I have reason to suspect, that they are all but the effects of nature, the issues of self-love acting under several disguises; and this principle is so powerful, and so deeply rooted in me, that I can never hope to be delivered from the dominion of it. I may toss and turn as a door on the hinges, but can never get clear off, or be quite unhinged of self, which is still the centre of all my motions."

"I am persuaded, O God, I am persuaded, that I can never be happy, till my carnal and corrupt affections be mortified, and the pride and vanity of my spirit be subdued, and till I come seriously to despise the world, and think nothing of myself." (Henry Scougal, "The Life of God in the Soul of Man")

So we should be like watchmen?

"Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?" (Luke 3:7)

Who indeed? I think maybe we don't warn each other so much, because we don't see our own hearts so very clearly. When we do, we will perhaps again hear of hell.

P.S. A word to people who are always down on themselves, this is probably not a message for you! Though we can also be feasting on sadness, this being part of the sickness of our human hearts.

[KingsGambit]

I'm aware of the verses used to cobble together a universalistic approach to scripture, but I honestly don't see how one can affirm that meaning when alternative contexts are available for every one, and when there are explicit statements elsewhere such as "they shall never enter my rest".

[lee_merrill]

I'm aware of the verses used to cobble together a universalistic approach to scripture, but I honestly don't see how one can affirm that meaning when alternative contexts are available for every one, and when there are explicit statements elsewhere such as "they shall never enter my rest".

Well, I didn't want to get sidetracked there! My thoughts on the subject here.

[Rdr. Arsenios]

"I am persuaded, O God, I am persuaded, that I can never be happy, till my carnal and corrupt affections be mortified, and the pride and vanity of my spirit be subdued, and till I come seriously to despise the world, and think nothing of myself." (Henry Scougal, "The Life of God in the Soul of Man")

So we should be like watchmen?

"Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?" (Luke 3:7)

Who indeed? I think maybe we don't warn each other so much, because we don't see our own hearts so very clearly. When we do, we will perhaps again hear of hell.

An Orthodox saint relates: "Knowledge of one's self is a greater spiritual attainment than that of bringing a dead man back to life..." [St. isaac, the Syrian, I believe it was.] This from a Saint who saw clearly into his own heart... Most Orthodox Saints do indeed see clearly themselves...

But here is my issue with you: You desire a WARNING for men, and there is NO warning that is enough to turn men from evil... The fear of God is but the Beginning of virtue, it is not the end, and most of us when we begin are so caught up in evils that we despair of even trying to embrace wholly what is good... And being warned of that which they see as hopelessness in their enslavement to sin, the warnings of anyone are but an irritant, or a confirmation of their despair... And they turn to the world for diversions in sins so as to not think about their actual inward condition...

So what is it that they NEED??? They need Saints... They need to see men and women who are not afraid, who love God, who know themselves, and who can see people in their sins and love them and weep for them and pray for them... This is what gives them hope, and from this hope comes the courage to try, and through the prayers of intercession of those righteous ones [Saints] who see and love them, they find the way, or better, they CAN find the way, to succeed in turning their lives toward goodness and mercy and love, and even slight efforts in this regard will be honored by God, and Grace will flow to them in their otherwise hopeless plight...

This is how the Apostles spread the Gospel of Christ... And the Holy Spirit prepared the way... And ANY who desired to follow Christ was able to first deny himself, then take up his own cross each day, and follow Him... Threats of Hell and warnings did not help... The rich man was not permitted to warn his brothers... Not out of mean-ness, but because they did not believe the prophets... And would not believe him coming back from the dead...

Fear of punishment is NOT the Love of God, you see...

The Gospel is this: "Repent and be Baptized, for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand!" Flee to Christ and work out your salvation... All who come to Him in repentance will be saved...

Arsenios

[lee_merrill]

Threats of Hell and warnings did not help... The rich man was not permitted to warn his brothers... Not out of mean-ness, but because they did not believe the prophets... And would not believe him coming back from the dead...

Yet his story is a warning, to us. Let us believe him.

Fear of punishment is NOT the Love of God, you see...

Quite so, but both are needed.

"How little encouragement will carry us to the affairs of this life! And yet all the helps God offers will hardly prevail with our backward natures." (Richard Sibbes, "The Bruised Reed")

You may also hear on occasion that the person who spoke the most often of hell, was Jesus.

"I think it is reasonable to try and frighten people away from hell” (Jonathan Edwards)

In this apparently, the Lord would concur.

The Gospel is this: "Repent and be Baptized, for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand!" Flee to Christ and work out your salvation... All who come to Him in repentance will be saved...

Amen...

Blessing and grace,
Lee