Muslims why are you murdering christians?????

[Cow Poke]

Just love it when a Christian starts to yell!

Cheers

Well, maybe somebody will start doing that for you.

[Cow Poke]

Oh, I see! So a link that shows Christians and Muslims killing each other is not a link that shows Christians are killing Muslims!!!!!

If I said that Germans were killing Brits, would you say that's a fair assessment of World War II? You tend to leave out some important details. You're only telling PART of the story. That's dishonest.

With many of your posts along with the "tone",

You're ASSUMING tone, where there is none. Perhaps your little feelings are hurt?

you imply that I do not believe that there are more attacks on Christians than on Muslims.

Absolutely false. Perhaps you inferred that, but I did not imply it.

I have never said that. If you read my response to Cybelle, you will see that I agree with her. There have been many more attacks on Christians in recent years. All I have ever said is that Christians kill Muslims and that Christians are not totally blameless........end of story.

Then your communication skills are terribly lacking.

Nobody has the right to kill anybody, no matter what.

Another false statement.

And if you are on about a "numbers game", then in the eyes of your God, is killing 1 Muslim any worse/better than killing 2 Christians????

A "numbers game"? Are you just here to play games?

So why are you telling me something that I already know????? Didn't my statement already tell you that I do know the derivations of the Christian Religion??? Please read more carefully.

Please communicate more effectively.

Once again, you fail to answer my questions with respect to your God of the past and your God of the present. I will ask you again. Since Christianity is so much different today than "in those days" and because the Old and New testaments are so different, is the God of the past different to the God of today and is the God of the Old Testament different to the God of the New?

God is the same yesterday, today and forever.

And, if I wanted to twist what you said, I wouldn't have asked for clarification. Your accusations are false. If you do not want someone to misinterpret, then please write with clarification.

WOW --- look who's talking!

bAD LUCK. wRONG AGAIN. (Rats, forgot the Caps Lock.)

Cheers

What has not changed is that Islam teaches its followers to kill Christians. "It is written". Islam masquerades as "peace" while advocating "murder".

[Cow Poke]

I find it interesting, that at a time when several Middle East countries are striving to be more democratic, that violence against minorities is on the increase. It doesn't make sense.

Can you please list the Middle East countries that are striving to be more democratic? Please note that a follow-up question will involve how well that's going.

[Cybelle Hawke]

Very interesting translation, CH.
And, yes, I agree that there seems to be a lot of misunderstanding on the part of the west that Arabs are, necessarily, Muslims.
I thought it was interesting that Abderrahim seemed to make it very clear that the difference between Christians and Muslims, in his (her?) eyes, is that a tenent of our Faith is forgiveness, and a tenent of Muslim faith is (not explicitly stated, but implied) conquest.

Perhaps you could comment on your perception of the notion that "peace" is not so much the proper interpretation of "Islam" as "surrender" is? Or is that a faulty notion.

Thanks,
CP

Sorry to respond to your request only now CP, which is mainly because I have been pondering on your question.

Abderrahim puts forgiveness versus avenge, when pointing out our difference in available "tools" to deal with suffering and acquire inner peace. I suppose you know what avenging to acquire inner peace means. If not I shall try to explain that.

[Cow Poke]

Sorry to respond to your request only now CP, which is mainly because I have been pondering on your question.

No problem at all ... I appreciate your thoughtfulness.

Abderrahim puts forgiveness versus avenge, when pointing out our difference in available "tools" to deal with suffering and acquire inner peace. I suppose you know what avenging to acquire inner peace means. If not I shall try to explain that.

Christians are nowadays no longer involved with going into the world and making all people His disciples, baptise them and teach them all that He has commanded (Matt 28:19).

I guess I'm an oddball, CH.... I don't believe we have achieved this -- I think we've just made it more complicated than it should be.

Somehow they feel that they have achieved this but we cannot forget that christianity was spread by conquering. Perhaps we have no scripture to sustain that we can use violence, but that has not kept us....

Christianity wasn't always spread by conquering --- and I have to wonder at the actual results of this method. Christianity was spread by persecution from without -- the more the Church was persecuted, the deeper its roots grew. I think this is part of the probelm -- we live a life of ease in 21st century Christianity. And, while we don't have a scripture in NT to condone violence, we certainly have scriptures that teach against it.

Muslims are equally eager to grow with their religion and they are convinced that their prophet is right, just as convinced as we think Jesus is right. This is a very complicated matter, when it comes to peace in the world, unless we all abstain from converting eachother and leave people to their own choice.

This would require, for a Christian, disobedience to the Great Commission. But I don't believe we have to kill or beat people up to tell them about Jesus.

Yet religious leaders have the unfortunate tendancy to wanting to grow.... and they have a sharp eye for collecting a flock who is willing to comply with their wishes.

There are plenty of those, to be sure, but the megachurches are not "winnning" by battle or violence, they're doing it by tickling the ears of their prospects.

I think that before 9/11 there has been a difference in the attitude from christians towards muslims, and muslims were definitely more fanatic and opposite to christians inclined to use violence.
After 9/11 both have become more harsh and the victims of this are the minority of muslims in the West and the minority of Christians in the East.

That may all be true, but we don't see Christians routinely killing Muslims because our Scriptures command us to do so. On the other hand, Jihad is basically the battle cry of the Muslim to covert or kill the infidel --- ME!

I tend to 'conclude' that whatever wrong we do to muslims in the West, will be paid by christians in the East. This is the new terroristic order I see coming up.

Crimes or violence against Muslims in the west is a hate crime, and worse than if you beat up a non-Muslim. Where are Muslims in the West being killed by Christians? On the other hand, Christians in the East are being killed BECAUSE they are Christians, and being killed by people BECAUSE they are Muslims.

And I pray that wiser minds will prevail.

[Cow Poke]

I have to comment on the notion that the killing of Christians in the East is somehow related to the treatment of Muslims in the west. I don't really buy that. They hate us because of who we are, and because we are not Muslims. We could be super nice to ALL the Muslims in the west, and that is not going to translate into "Oh, I guess us Muslims need to start being nice to Christians, and appreciate thier presence among us".

It's not going to happen.

[Cybelle Hawke]

I edited my post completely wrong. Anyway, I am not aware of a muslim concept that strives towards peace in the world...(but I am far from being an expert so feel free to correct me)

I think christians assume that peace in the world can be maintained by granting freedom of religion but both christians and muslims have tremendous trouble in staying peaceful towards those who have done them or their beloved ones harm.

Surrender to Allah is a very important mission for the Islam religion to spread out. But Matt 28:19 also calls out for making all peoples disciples of Christ.

In the Qu´ran I do not see where in this surrender and converting peace comes in; in the curriculum of christian history I see that peace has been put aside every now and then.

The only thing I know is that muslims are as convinced that Mohammed is right, as christians are that Jesus is right. And this makes a peaceful co-existance only possible, when both submit to the concept of freedom of religion. I see that the West is perhaps too tolerant, and the Arab world not tolerant at all.

I do invite all christians and muslims to pray for this growing tension between muslims and christians to come to a stop and that the wiser minds prevail both in the West and in the East.

[Cow Poke]

I edited my post completely wrong. Anyway, I am not aware of a muslim concept that strives towards peace in the world...(but I am far from being an expert so feel free to correct me)

There is much disagreement about the meaning of the word Islam. It is "westernized" to indicate that it means "peace". Here is another perspective.

http://www.answering-islam.org/Hoaxes/salamislam.html

Islam & Peace

Bassam Darwich

Muslim propagandists are nowadays making extraordinary efforts to change the image of Islam by reintroducing it to the Western society as a religion that calls for peace and rejects violence. One of the new theories that they are trying to sell is that the name of their religion Islam implies the meaning of ‘Peace’, which in Arabic is Salam. The grounds for their theory is that both words are derived from the same root in the Arabic language!

While it may be possible to deceive those who do not speak Arabic or those who do not know much about Islam, propaganda like this does not fool someone who knows the Arabic language and the teaching of Islam, a religion that was established by violence and still believes in violence as a principal and as a way of life. The relationships between Muslims themselves and between them and all other nations have always been based on terror and still is. Islam and Salam are two incongruous words that share no common ground either in name or in substance.

© source where applicable

There is nothing in Christianity that we can use to justify killing people for their failure to accept Christ as Savior.
On the other hand, there's Islam.

[Cybelle Hawke]

No problem at all ... I appreciate your thoughtfulness.



I guess I'm an oddball, CH.... I don't believe we have achieved this -- I think we've just made it more complicated than it should be.



Christianity wasn't always spread by conquering --- and I have to wonder at the actual results of this method. Christianity was spread by persecution from without -- the more the Church was persecuted, the deeper its roots grew. I think this is part of the probelm -- we live a life of ease in 21st century Christianity. And, while we don't have a scripture in NT to condone violence, we certainly have scriptures that teach against it.



This would require, for a Christian, disobedience to the Great Commission. But I don't believe we have to kill or beat people up to tell them about Jesus.



There are plenty of those, to be sure, but the megachurches are not "winnning" by battle or violence, they're doing it by tickling the ears of their prospects.



That may all be true, but we don't see Christians routinely killing Muslims because our Scriptures command us to do so. On the other hand, Jihad is basically the battle cry of the Muslim to covert or kill the infidel --- ME!



Crimes or violence against Muslims in the west is a hate crime, and worse than if you beat up a non-Muslim. Where are Muslims in the West being killed by Christians? On the other hand, Christians in the East are being killed BECAUSE they are Christians, and being killed by people BECAUSE they are Muslims.

You see how the things go..... I edited this post wrongly, that is, I wanted to delete something and ended up deleting the whole thing. As I could not correct it, or did not know how to do that, I wrote a new post. Yet you reacted to my deleted post.... and so we kept missing eachother´s ideas and thought.

I will come back to both your posts a little later this afternoon and then we can set straight what went wrong in the correspondence.

Talk to you later CP and thank you for the generous amount of time you spend on my thread. It is a real pleasure interacting with you (as always).

[Cow Poke]

Here's a link to a video I would love to have a Muslim watch and comment on....

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2010/03/an...ubmission.html

[Cybelle Hawke]

I have to comment on the notion that the killing of Christians in the East is somehow related to the treatment of Muslims in the west. I don't really buy that. They hate us because of who we are, and because we are not Muslims. We could be super nice to ALL the Muslims in the west, and that is not going to translate into "Oh, I guess us Muslims need to start being nice to Christians, and appreciate thier presence among us".

It's not going to happen.

No not that way! There is no room for infidels in the concept of islam. And yes that is YOU and ME (lol)

I do see a connection between muslims being treated in the West and christians being treated in the East. The huge difference is that Christians do not go out and kill muslims. And should they do so, then it will most certainly not stay unpunished.

But muslims ARE treated in the West as potential terrorists. I am not saying that this is unjustified! But we cannot say that muslims are treated equally as Budhists, Jews or Hindoes for instance

Anyhow this thread is about the killing of christians. And yes, I believe too that they are being murdered because of their religion.

I think I got carried away by a shout of a muslim on FB that all christians in the Arab world should be kept hostage to drive the West to their knees. Goodness, the tone of this person was sooo frightening that it still gives me the shivers. I should have known better to post this here on Tweb though. That was actually part of the editing I intended to do.

[Cow Poke]

No not that way! There is no room for infidels in the concept of islam. And yes that is YOU and ME (lol)

I do see a connection between muslims being treated in the West and christians being treated in the East. The huge difference is that Christians do not go out and kill muslims. And should they do so, then it will most certainly not stay unpunished.

As I said, it's a hate crime in the US to kill somebody because they're a Muslim.

But muslims ARE treated in the West as potential terrorists. I am not saying that this is unjustified! But we cannot say that muslims are treated equally as Budhists, Jews or Hindoes for instance

Well, think about that... the TSA, for example, makes ALL of us take our shoes off and have our bags inspected and even pokes around in granny's undies BECAUSE they don't want to appear to be treating Muslims differently --- even though STATUSTICALLY, there is an INCREDIBLY HIGH percentage of Muslim involvement in US Air violence --- aka 9-11.

Anyhow this thread is about the killing of christians. And yes, I believe too that they are being murdered because of their religion.

I think I got carried away by a shout of a muslim on FB that all christians in the Arab world should be kept hostage to drive the West to their knees. Goodness, the tone of this person was sooo frightening that it still gives me the shivers. I should have known better to post this here on Tweb though. That was actually part of the editing I intended to do.

Terrorism is a legitmate tool, in their eyes, of Islam.

[One Bad Pig]

Why wouldn't they. Apathy does not mean that they do not talk. There is no law against talking to an outsider about their feelings on a range of topics. Should have heard the nice things they said about Christians.

Apathy means they don't CARE. If they're talking anyway, they're just telling you what you want to hear.

dON'T YOU READ YOUR OWN POSTS? (rATS! THAT caps lock AGAIN!!!)

cHEERS

Yes, I read my own posts. However, we don't seem to be interpreting them in the same way, and I was hoping that you'd share your perspective. If I don't know I'm doing something wrong, how can I change?

[seanD]

Terrorism is a legitmate tool, in their eyes, of Islam.

Imagine what jihadists could do if they had unmanned drones. "Terrorism" is merely a word that is defined within the eye of the beholder. Other than 911, the only terrorists acts I see defined as terrorism by the west (other than just fearmongering about what could potentially happen if we don't give government more and more power to keep us safe) are Muslims defending their homeland from foreign occupiers; and since they basically live in the stone-age, they use any means necessary to do it. It doesn't mean it's right or wrong; it's just sort of a natural reaction one would have if any country was invaded by another country for whatever reason.

[Cow Poke]

Imagine what jihadists could do if they had unmanned drones. "Terrorism" is merely a word that is defined within the eye of the beholder. Other than 911, the only terrorists acts I see defined as terrorism by the west (other than just fearmongering about what could potentially happen if we don't give government more and more power to keep us safe) are Muslims defending their homeland from foreign occupiers;

The USS Cole fits into this category?

and since they basically live in the stone-age, they use any means necessary to do it.

Perhaps you will be comforted when Iran uses Nukes against on non-Muslims?

It doesn't mean it's right or wrong; it's just sort of a natural reaction one would have if any country was invaded by another country for whatever reason.

I'm guessing you're not a Jew.