The word "Jew" in the Bible

[Cow Poke]

"Jew" comes from "the tribe of Judah" one of the 12 hebrew tribes. so no matter what the word or how it was spelled the meaning is the same, someone from the tribe of judah (which if I recall was combined with benjamin) - so even if the ancient people called them something other than "jew" the meaning is exactly the same.

Yeah, Judah was one of the twelve tribes, and received a special blessing as far back as Genesis 49:1 and 8-10.

[Adrift]

"Jew" comes from "the tribe of Judah" one of the 12 hebrew tribes. so no matter what the word or how it was spelled the meaning is the same, someone from the tribe of judah (which if I recall was combined with benjamin) - so even if the ancient people called them something other than "jew" the meaning is exactly the same.

Which raises the question, can those Israelites not from the tribe of Judah properly be called Jews? "Jew" and "Israelite" have since become synonymous, but technically probably not. The existence of modern Samaritans (which now only number in the hundreds) seems to indicate that while all Jews are ethnically Israelites, probably not all ethnic Israelites are Jews.

[Sparko]

If I remember correctly, strict matrilineality for determining Jewishness may have been a Talmudic convention. Modern Karaite Jews determine Jewishness through the father. It probably didn't really matter much in Jesus' period which parent was a Jew, but it's just more goofiness to assume that Jesus was not Jewish simply because of the virgin birth. I'm sure there's apologetics for dealing with Jews and Muslims who hold this opinion, but it never ceases to amaze me that distances people go to hold onto their pet theories.

pretty much this probably has to do with the fact that Muslims hate Jews but consider Jesus a great prophet. They need to separate him from the Jews or they have a conflict of interest.

[Christian3]

Oh brother. How silly. If he's seriously attempting to suggest that the word "Jew" didn't exist in English because "I" and "J" weren't standardized until later, he's a nutter and not worth bothering with. Here's a copy of the same passage from a 1637/38 copy of the King James where the "I" and "J" have become standardized (notice the lower-case "s" still isn't standardized),

He didn't know about the "I" and "J" but he does now thanks to the good folks here. :)

He is a nutter. I wasn't sure I could say what I really think of him here -- maybe the Mods wouldn't like it.

I have two reasons for wanting to bother with him.

One: I'd like to educate him.
Two: Research like this helps me understand the issue, so I get educated.

[Christian3]

If Momma ain't Jewish, ain't NOBODY Jewish!

This is an interesting article recommended to me from a Jew:

http://www.beingjewish.com/identity/whoisajew.html

[Teallaura]

If He wasn't Jewish because He didn't have a Jewish father, wouldn't that mean He also wasn't human?

Regardless of the English interpretation, Christ was unquestionably of the Hebrews.


Also, even if the word 'Jew' wasn't in the KJV, it wouldn't matter at all - the KJV was translated from the Latin Vulgate, not the extant documents. Going from Greek/Aramaic/Hebrew to English with a detour through Latin is bound to end up with a few quirks.

[Christian3]

pretty much this probably has to do with the fact that Muslims hate Jews but consider Jesus a great prophet. They need to separate him from the Jews or they have a conflict of interest.

Muslims hate Jews for a variety of reasons. Some won't admit hating them.

One Muslim told me that it is partly because of Palestine, but more than that -- it is that "The Jews should have known that Muhammad was a prophet and they rejected him."

Others (most?) believe that the Jews stole Ishmael's birthright. The Jews changed their Scriptures in saying that it was Ishmael who God asked to sacrifice, so the Covenant should have gone through him rather than Isaac.

Muslims also believe all of God's promises went through Ishmael and not the Jews. They claim that Jesus gave the Kingdom to Muslims and use the following verse from Jesus as proof:

Matthew 21:

42 Jesus said to them, “Have you never read in the Scriptures:

The stone that the builders rejected
has become the cornerstone.
This came from the Lord
and is wonderful in our eyes?

(The stone rejected is Muhammad.)

43 Therefore I tell you, the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a nation producing its fruit."

(The nation is Islam.)

[Cerebrum123]

Muslims hate Jews for a variety of reasons. Some won't admit hating them.

One Muslim told me that it is partly because of Palestine, but more than that -- it is that "The Jews should have known that Muhammad was a prophet and they rejected him."

Others (most?) believe that the Jews stole Ishmael's birthright. The Jews changed their Scriptures in saying that it was Ishmael who God asked to sacrifice, so the Covenant should have gone through him rather than Isaac.

Muslims also believe all of God's promises went through Ishmael and not the Jews. They claim that Jesus gave the Kingdom to Muslims and use the following verse from Jesus as proof:

Matthew 21:

42 Jesus said to them, “Have you never read in the Scriptures:

The stone that the builders rejected
has become the cornerstone.
This came from the Lord
and is wonderful in our eyes?

(The stone rejected is Muhammad.)

43 Therefore I tell you, the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a nation producing its fruit."

(The nation is Islam.)

Muslims always have been good at eisegesis.

[Christian3]

Muslims always have been good at eisegesis.

Yes, they are. Just look at where they find Muhammad and Islam in the Bible: none of them work.

They also hate Apostle Paul and it is not hard to know why.

[Cow Poke]

Yes, they are. Just look at where they find Muhammad and Islam in the Bible: none of them work.

They also hate Apostle Paul and it is not hard to know why.

Look how many times the Holy City of Jerusalem is mentioned in the Koran.