A Mormon Testimony. The foundation and the superstructure.

[Xru]

Were you addressing OC or CP?

I'm addressing you OC!

You are one lame motor-head.

Getting off on all the attention here OC. Make you feel all blown up 'cause you have the Knowledge?

You are pathetic.

[OtherCheek]

That's a strawmen OC for no, I have several avenues to prove the authority of the Bible with. I have a sold ground of philosophy that shows me how philosophically complete and amazing the philosophy of Christianity really is while Mormonism is full of philosophical holes such as the circular path your Testimony has to take. Next, we find that the Bible is archeologically sound and describes many places that have been found to not only exist, but show a lay out how it is described within the text of the Bible, while the BoM has shown itself to describe no places that really have shown to exist and appears to be made up fiction. Another avenue is how the Bible lines up with anthropology and how much it shows a knowledge of the ancient world it was written in, while the BoM shows Jesus talking to the ancient Americans in Greek terms they would have no reference for (the ancient Americans had no clue what the Alpha and Omega was, so Jesus using the phrase to them would be him talking nonsense). Sorry OC, you might think that way, but I do not. I believe the Bible to be authoritative because it shows itself to be dead on accurate in many different, testable areas. Can the same be said about the BoM?

That is why I wrote:

There is also a temptation in this physical world to build ones spiritual beliefs atop a foundation of secular learning, and tangible physical evidences; or upon a foundation of participation in Church auxiliary programs and activities. Such an inverted testimony will not stand through times of severe adversity and testing because it is not founded upon the “Rock” as Jesus taught that it should. That is why some people lose their testimonies, and fall away from their faith–and I’m not just talking about Mormons losing their faith. This happens in all denominations.

Such an inverted foundation shows more trust in the physical world and secular learning, than in the power of prayer the power of God to reveal himself spiritually through the Holy Spirit.

[lilpixieofterror]

That is why I wrote:

So in other words...

"You're just not spiritual enough to understand!"

And thus your beliefs are all about ignoring evidence and just blindly believing. Sorry OC, I can't not just 'blindly believe' what is contradictory to fact and reason and I'm not alone in this. Many of the church fathers felt the same way.

BTW OC, in the Bible, the Holy Spirit did not come upon the Apostles until they had witnessed the risen Jesus, had been part of his earthly ministry for 3 years, and and had already believed him as their Lord and savior. The Holy Spirit did not come, until these things happened. Interestingly enough, your church seems to want to reverse the process and wants us to view everything though it's own lens of faith. Christianity doesn't do that. Why OC? It is because I am confident that Christianity can stand on it's own merits and it doesn't need a pre assumption biasness for me and other to believe it.

[Xru]

OC is hereby consigned to the title Mormon Troll.

[Xru]

So in other words...

"You're just not spiritual enough to understand!"

And thus your beliefs are all about ignoring evidence and just blindly believing. Sorry OC, I can't not just 'blindly believe' what is contradictory to fact and reason and I'm not alone in this. Many of the church fathers felt the same way.

It's as I suspected. He's not making sense because he's a Mormon troll out to have his kicks on Tweb.

[OtherCheek]

I'm addressing you OC!
.

Oh. Maybe I'll just let you talk amongst yourselves.

See ya.

[Xru]

Oh. Maybe I'll just let you talk amongst yourselves.

See ya.

Ouch, ha ha ah aha a ha h.

That'd be just great if you'd leave. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Gee what will we do without OC. Yes!!!!!!!!!

BTW, even better if you never come back.

[lilpixieofterror]

It's as I suspected. He's not making sense because he's a Mormon troll out to have his kicks on Tweb.

Well Xru, it is because of the giant circle he created for himself...

The Mormon Church is the true church because the Mormon Church is the true church because the Mormon Church is the true church because...

He has stuck his beliefs beyond examination and beyond understanding so he doesn't have to back them up. It's little more than deck stacking.

[lilpixieofterror]

Oh. Maybe I'll just let you talk amongst yourselves.

See ya.

That's right OC, ignore any challenges to your faith.

[Xru]

Well Xru, it is because of the giant circle he created for himself...

The Mormon Church is the true church because the Mormon Church is the true church because the Mormon Church is the true church because...

He has stuck his beliefs beyond examination and beyond understanding so he doesn't have to back them up. It's little more than deck stacking.

Clear enough to you and I . . . but what about him. Really is crazy.

Actually • Edited by a Moderator • to suggest we ignore the teachings of Jesus . . . . meh, hopefully we'll never see him again.

Moderated By: rogue06

Xru! Didn't your mom teach you to watch your language?

***If you wish to take issue with this notice DO NOT do so in this thread.***
Contact the forum moderator or an administrator in Private Message or email instead. If you feel you must publically complain or whine, please take it to the Psychotherapy Room unless told otherwise.

sorry CP . . .guess I rode him out of Dodge.

[OtherCheek]

Ouch, ha ha ah aha a ha h.

That'd be just great if you'd leave. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Gee what will we do without OC. Yes!!!!!!!!!

BTW, even better if you never come back.

Sorry, X.

But you should understand that I love my faith, and I love defending it. You probably love defending your beliefs from criticism from non-believers too. But I realize that defending my beliefs may upset people who don't share my beliefs. All in all, I try no to get personal with people and insult them and call them names. But I won't apologize for my testimony.

And maybe upsetting people comes naturally for me.

Sorry.

[Xru]

Sorry, X.

But you should understand that I love my faith, and I love defending it. You probably love defending your beliefs from criticism from non-believers too. But I realize that defending my beliefs may upset people who don't share my beliefs. All in all, I try no to get personal with people and insult them and call them names. But I won't apologize for my testimony.

And maybe upsetting people comes naturally for me.

Sorry.

You suggested ignoring the teaching of Jesus. Shame on you. It is heretical and you of all people should know that.

I'll pray for you . . . I suggest you pray for yourself too.

I don't give a crap if you call me any name you want. I care about you but . . . I draw the line when someone like yourself is heretical. That is way over the line and as a Christian you know that. Take a long hard look at yourself dude.

[Cow Poke]

No. I would not invert the base of my foundation with the things at the top. It what a rhetorical question for consideration, meant to illustrate my point.

I think it failed miserably, OC. Your entire worldview is through Joseph Smith. It's all you seem to know.

[Cow Poke]

To you, a person with no "holding place" for such knowledge, he is a con man.

In other words, because I have not been pre-duped, I can see him for the liar and deceiver that he is.

Having a testimony of Heavenly Father and Christ, leads to the trust that God loves us will not try to deceive us.

Yes, OC, you keep reciting the mantra --- you have been conned by the con man, and you will see him as a prophet, just like the followers of David Koresh bought into his fraudulent claims. AMAZING similarities between Smith and Koresh.

How do you know that Koresh was not a true prophet? What would you tell his followers, if they were still alive.

[Cow Poke]

But you should understand that I love my faith, and I love defending it.

You're not defending your faith, OC -- you're just repeating the same old mantra over and over... "I have a Testimony" that Joseph Smith is a true prophet.... and where did you GET your "Testimony"? From the teachings of Joseph Smith.

And maybe upsetting people comes naturally for me.

Not because of your faith, OC -- because of your conduct.

So, you're here to defend your faith, eh?

Oh. Maybe I'll just let you talk amongst yourselves.

See ya.

AGAIN, "I'm done".. then back.. confusion!