"Name had for good and evil..."

[OtherCheek]

“He called me by name, and said unto me that he was a messenger sent from the presence of God to me, and that his name was Moroni; that God had a work for me to do; and that my name should be had for good and evil among all nations, kindreds, and tongues, or that it should be both good and evil spoken of among all people” (JS—H 1:33).

I have never seen a prophecy verified on such a regular basis as this one. To me, it serves as a testimony builder, and one more reason why I believe what I believe.

I wonder if today in 2012 there is a name more highly recognized and known throughout the world, (save the name of Jesus Christ), than the name "Joseph Smith?" It would make for an interesting study for the Mormon community.

[Hamster]

The Pope, Obama, Osama Bin Laden, Mickey Mouse, Satan, Adolf Hitler, Muhammad, Batman, Superman, Elvis, Ronald McDonald, The Coca Cola polar bears, The Pillsbury dough boy, The energizer bunny, Kool-Aid man, Martin Luther King Jr, Joseph Stalin, Winston Churchill, Socrates, Aristotle, Charles Dickens, Leonardo DiVinci, Buddha, Charles Darwin, Al Pacino, Fred Nietzsche, Super Mario, John the Baptist, The Virgin Mary, Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Carl Sagan, The Easter Bunny, Brigham Young, Confucious, Moses, Isaiah, Adam, Eve, Paul, The Beatles, Ganesh, St. Joseph

[Thersites]

Buddha.

Muhammad is the most common name in the world.

So, yeah, I think this is a non-starter, OC. Sorry, bro.

[Adrift]

Muhammad, Buddha, Einstein, William Shakespeare, Adolf Hitler, Elvis Presley, John F. Kennedy, Mahatma Gandhi, Mother Theresa, Michael Jackson... To be honest, I don't know if Joseph Smith would even be in the top 100. I can say with some confidence that most of my extended family, many of my friends, and most of my coworkers (with the obvious exception of my Mormon boss, his son, and maybe a couple others) would know the name "Joseph Smith". I'm assuming that's probably true for most other non-Mormons as well.

[Hamster]

Don't worry, these are just worldly facts supported by evidence (or dare I say... Evildence?)

[One Bad Pig]

“He called me by name, and said unto me that he was a messenger sent from the presence of God to me, and that his name was Moroni; that God had a work for me to do; and that my name should be had for good and evil among all nations, kindreds, and tongues, or that it should be both good and evil spoken of among all people” (JS—H 1:33).

I have never seen a prophecy verified on such a regular basis as this one. To me, it serves as a testimony builder, and one more reason why I believe what I believe.

I wonder if today in 2012 there is a name more highly recognized and known throughout the world, (save the name of Jesus Christ), than the name "Joseph Smith?" It would make for an interesting study for the Mormon community.

I have never seen a more boastful prophecy.

[OtherCheek]

The Pope, Obama, Osama Bin Laden, Mickey Mouse, Satan, Adolf Hitler, Muhammad, Batman, Superman, Elvis, Ronald McDonald, The Coca Cola polar bears, The Pillsbury dough boy, The energizer bunny, Kool-Aid man, Martin Luther King Jr, Joseph Stalin, Winston Churchill, Socrates, Aristotle, Charles Dickens, Leonardo DiVinci, Buddha, Charles Darwin, Al Pacino, Fred Nietzsche, Super Mario, John the Baptist, The Virgin Mary, Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Carl Sagan, The Easter Bunny, Brigham Young, Confucious, Moses, Isaiah, Adam, Eve, Paul, The Beatles, Ganesh, St. Joseph

Well, there are a few names in that list that might be better known. Here's a quote from a current LDS General Authority John H. Groberg's book "In the Eye of the Storm" which is one of the better books on my shelf. He recounts his missionary experience in the islands of Tonga. A movie was made about it with Ann Hathaway in it called "The other side of Heaven"

Elder Groberg and his companion sailed to the island of Tafahi, located about eight miles from their home island of Niuatoputapu. About 80 people lived on Tafahi. Like the people on Niuatoputapu, the people on Tafahi had no running water or electricity, but they were even more isolated from the outside world since they had no telegraph or scheduled boats.

When Elder Groberg visited, the island had only 18 homes, and the missionaries visited each one. He wrote: “At the last home, a strange thought occurred to me, ‘Why don’t you test the prophecy that the name of Joseph Smith should be known for good and evil throughout the world?’ I don’t know why the thought came, but it did.”

The missionaries asked the family if they had ever heard of the president of the United States. “Who’s he?” and “Where’s the United States?” was their response. Elder Groberg reported: “I tried to explain where it was, but they couldn’t understand. They asked how big an island it was. I replied that it was a very big island, thousands of miles away with millions of people living on it. I told them that many people there had never even seen the ocean and that many people didn’t know one another. They couldn’t comprehend that.”

He then asked if they had heard of Russia and France and their leaders; he asked about movie stars, sports figures, and world political leaders. They knew nothing of these places or people, nor of world events such as the Depression and the Korean War.

Elder Groberg recalled: “There was not a member of the Church living on this island, although there were two other churches there. I took a deep breath and said, ‘Have you ever heard of Joseph Smith?’”

“Immediately their faces lit up. Everyone looked at me, and the father said, ‘Don’t talk to us about that false prophet! Not in our home! We know all about him. Our minister has told us!’ I could hardly believe what I was hearing. The scripture . . . sounded in my mind that Joseph’s name should be had for good and evil among all nations. . . . To me this was a direct fulfillment of prophecy.

“I am convinced that you could hardly get a place more remote, more out of touch with modern civilization, than the little island of Tafahi. The people there knew nothing of the great leaders of the day—political, economic, or otherwise—but they knew the name Joseph Smith. In this case they knew it for ill, at least to begin with. I spent the next few days explaining more of the mission of the Prophet Joseph Smith, and before we left, a few of them knew his name for good” ( In the Eye of the Storm [1993], 104–6).

It almost seems that wherever a Protestant Preacher has been in the world, he has mentioned the name "Joseph Smith." (For evil)

[Thersites]

Well, there are a few names in that list that might be better known. Here's a quote from a current LDS General Authority John H. Groberg's book "In the Eye of the Storm" which is one of the better books on my shelf. He recounts his missionary experience in the islands of Tonga. A movie was made about it with Ann Hathaway in it called "The other side of Heaven"

Elder Groberg and his companion sailed to the island of Tafahi, located about eight miles from their home island of Niuatoputapu. About 80 people lived on Tafahi. Like the people on Niuatoputapu, the people on Tafahi had no running water or electricity, but they were even more isolated from the outside world since they had no telegraph or scheduled boats.

When Elder Groberg visited, the island had only 18 homes, and the missionaries visited each one. He wrote: “At the last home, a strange thought occurred to me, ‘Why don’t you test the prophecy that the name of Joseph Smith should be known for good and evil throughout the world?’ I don’t know why the thought came, but it did.”

The missionaries asked the family if they had ever heard of the president of the United States. “Who’s he?” and “Where’s the United States?” was their response. Elder Groberg reported: “I tried to explain where it was, but they couldn’t understand. They asked how big an island it was. I replied that it was a very big island, thousands of miles away with millions of people living on it. I told them that many people there had never even seen the ocean and that many people didn’t know one another. They couldn’t comprehend that.”

He then asked if they had heard of Russia and France and their leaders; he asked about movie stars, sports figures, and world political leaders. They knew nothing of these places or people, nor of world events such as the Depression and the Korean War.

Elder Groberg recalled: “There was not a member of the Church living on this island, although there were two other churches there. I took a deep breath and said, ‘Have you ever heard of Joseph Smith?’”

“Immediately their faces lit up. Everyone looked at me, and the father said, ‘Don’t talk to us about that false prophet! Not in our home! We know all about him. Our minister has told us!’ I could hardly believe what I was hearing. The scripture . . . sounded in my mind that Joseph’s name should be had for good and evil among all nations. . . . To me this was a direct fulfillment of prophecy.

“I am convinced that you could hardly get a place more remote, more out of touch with modern civilization, than the little island of Tafahi. The people there knew nothing of the great leaders of the day—political, economic, or otherwise—but they knew the name Joseph Smith. In this case they knew it for ill, at least to begin with. I spent the next few days explaining more of the mission of the Prophet Joseph Smith, and before we left, a few of them knew his name for good” ( In the Eye of the Storm [1993], 104–6).

It almost seems that wherever a Protestant Preacher has been in the world, he has mentioned the name "Joseph Smith." (For evil)

The Pope is more "popular" in that sense.

[nrajeff]

The Pope is more "popular" in that sense.

What percentage of the world's population knows who Joseph Aloisius Ratzinger is? What percentage of the world's Catholics recognize that name?

[Cow Poke]

It almost seems that wherever a Protestant Preacher has been in the world, he has mentioned the name "Joseph Smith." (For evil)

You would expect us to lie?

[Cow Poke]

What percentage of the world's population knows who Joseph Aloisius Ratzinger is? What percentage of the world's Catholics recognize that name?

Why would somebody need to know that, when he is so well known as the Pope? Seems a bit pedantic to me.

[Hamster]

I think "Brigham Young" is a much more recognized name than Joseph Smith. Because of the University and the fact that "Brigham Young" is a somewhat unique name compared to "Joseph Smith"

[OtherCheek]

I think "Brigham Young" is a much more recognized name than Joseph Smith. Because of the University and the fact that "Brigham Young" is a somewhat unique name compared to "Joseph Smith"

I wonder what goes through the mind of Evangelical parents with the last name of 'Smith' when they consider bible names for their baby boys. Probably not many with that name since 1830.

[Adrift]

I wonder what goes through the mind of Evangelical parents with the last name of 'Smith' when they consider bible names for their baby boys. Probably not many with that name since 1830.

You don't think there are that many people named Joe Smith since 1830??

[AlphaBravo]

He called me by name, and said unto me that he was a messenger sent from the presence of God to me, and that his name was Moroni; that God had a work for me to do; and that my name should be had for good and evil among all nations, kindreds, and tongues, or that it should be both good and evil spoken of among all people” (JS—H 1:33).

I have never seen a prophecy verified on such a regular basis as this one. To me, it serves as a testimony builder, and one more reason why I believe what I believe.

Have you ever considered that Joseph Smith wrote this preemptively knowing that his own crimes and bad character would be raised as an objection to his legitimacy and reliability?