Post here if you think atheists can't be good people

[Hamster]

I was a Catholic but then I got fatter

[headheart]

or do good things.

In discussions about objective morality ("is there goodness without God?" etc) it's common for the atheist or agnostic to reply by saying he doesn't need God to be good - misunderstanding what the discussion is actually about. I don't think I've ever seen anyone claim that atheists can't be good people. Is this really a thing? Is someone out there saying atheists drown crippled lambs and spit on cookies? It astounds me that this talking point is always brought up in during those discussions

For the purposes of this thread, "good person" means a well-meaning person who tries to do the right thing according to what they understand is right and wrong. No theological abstractions about us all being sinners and corrupt and no one is good except God. I'm staying strictly colloquial

Thing is Hamster that there is a new brand of atheist in town and she ain't 'well-meaning' or interested in doing 'the right thing according to what they understand is right and wrong' In short they just don't give a hoot about any opinion but the one which they are ramming down our throats in much the same way that their painful predecessors the vapid and vicious reformed preachers that stormed the English countryside frightening the out of (or would that be into) everyone and sundry. It's a disease and it's not getting better, it's only design it to evangelize, propagate and destroy every memory of religion on this planet. (check my recent rant ;) )

Oh bring back the day when atheists were all nice people to be with.

Peace,
Eric.

[Hamster]

Thing is Hamster that there is a new brand of atheist in town and she ain't 'well-meaning' or interested in doing 'the right thing according to what they understand is right and wrong' In short they just don't give a hoot about any opinion but the one which they are ramming down our throats in much the same way that their painful predecessors the vapid and vicious reformed preachers that stormed the English countryside frightening the out of (or would that be into) everyone and sundry. It's a disease and it's not getting better, it's only design it to evangelize, propagate and destroy every memory of religion on this planet. (check my recent rant ;) )

At the risk of sounding cliche, that kind of behavior is present as a flaw of human nature. There are atheist flavors of that and theist flavors of that and they've been around forever.

Especially when you consider dinosaurs lacked belief in gods and they killed anyone that got in their way.....................

[headheart]

At the risk of sounding cliche, that kind of behavior is present as a flaw of human nature. There are atheist flavors of that and theist flavors of that and they've been around forever.

Especially when you consider dinosaurs lacked belief in gods and they killed anyone that got in their way.....................

Nope, nope, nope don't water it down.
I'm well aware that there are similarities (my point) but the fact is that this has nothing to do with 'kind of behavior' or 'flaw of human nature' This new breed of atheist (if one can even call it atheism) is a deliberate and calculated program.

[headheart]

Program or what you say?

Part 2

It's not just those blokes once referred to as the four horsemen of the apocalypse who have a specific agenda; it's coming from believers (?) too:

e.g., ( just a fraction of the iceberg )

'So long as the Bible is seen as an unfailing moral guide and the sole, authoritative source of our images and metaphors of the divine, it should come as no surprise that a thousand people a day are walking away from evangelical churches, (also see here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, and here), that liberal churches are shrinking even faster, and that the ranks of atheists and secularists are swelling.
So here's my vision:

Thinking of "divine revelation" in mere mythic ways will last a few more decades. But knowing that God (Reality) communicates more clearly through evidence than ancient texts will change everything. Christianity itself will have a born-again experience by mid-century.

Looking back a hundred years from now, few things will be seen to have had a greater positive impact than the "Evidential Reformation" and the transformation that occurred when Christian leaders worldwide began teaching and preaching how "God's Word" is not limited to the Bible but is revealed in every fact discovered by science. Practically overnight the science versus religion war will end, and the Church will not only regain its moral authority but will become an inspiring force for evolutionary and ecological good in the world.'

Rev. Michael Dowd - New Atheists Promote Bible Study?

Peace,
Eric

[Tassman]

Thing is Hamster that there is a new brand of atheist in town and she ain't 'well-meaning' or interested in doing 'the right thing according to what they understand is right and wrong' In short they just don't give a hoot about any opinion but the one which they are ramming down our throats in much the same way that their painful predecessors the vapid and vicious reformed preachers that stormed the English countryside frightening the out of (or would that be into) everyone and sundry. It's a disease and it's not getting better, it's only design it to evangelize, propagate and destroy every memory of religion on this planet. (check my recent rant ;) )

Oh bring back the day when atheists were all nice people to be with.

Peace,
Eric.

"Ramming down our throats" just like the Evangelical Right ram Jesus down our throats. Is that what you're saying?

Look up "Conspiracy Theory", and reflect on your extraordinary assertions.

http://dictionary.reference.com/brow...spiracy+theory

[headheart]

"Ramming down our throats" just like the Evangelical Right ram Jesus down our throats. Is that what you're saying?

Look up "Conspiracy Theory", and reflect on your extraordinary assertions.

http://dictionary.reference.com/brow...spiracy+theory

Why don't you look it up seeing as it's right up your alley creep.

[Jedidiah]

That's funny, I was a Christian, but I got kinder.

I'm kinder than you.

[Jedidiah]

I was a Catholic but then I got fatter

You must be a Baptist now, eh?

[lao tzu]

It's not just those blokes once referred to as the four horsemen of the apocalypse who have a specific agenda; it's coming from believers (?) too:

Dennett, in his entry statement: "Religions have contrived to make it impossible to disagree with them critically without being rude. They play the hurt feelings card at every opportunity."

Harris: "Physicists aren't offended when their view of physics is disproved or challenged."

So what is it that was so offensive about that video? It's just atheists speaking about their experiences, something Christians do in the natural course of events without so much as an eyeblink. Do you find the following offensive? Is it too much in your face?

AD_Minimal_Final.png

A bus ad nearly identical to the above, but including the url for American Atheists as well, was refused by County of Lackawanna Transit System (COLTS) in Scranton, PA. as too controversial. Christians, apparently, are offended by our mere existence.

Eric, we can't win here, and can only achieve a draw by hiding in our closets. Yes, we are challenging your belief in the supernatural, for what seem to us to be pressing reasons in the aftermath of 9/11. Without a shadow of a doubt, it was 9/11 (and 7/7) that spurred Dawkins to speak out against supernaturalist beliefs. Similarly, it was 9/11 that spurred me to begin interacting with supernaturalists, first with muslims, and then a few years later with Christians.

But if that was the proverbial straw, it was not the last to fall on the camel's back. Ya'll need a lot of watching. It's a continuing game of whack-a-mole punching down the fundamentalist eruptions that are forever attempting to remove biology from our American schools, to rewrite the religious history of the US, and most recently, to deny or restrict access to contraceptives and birth control.

In any other discussion of public policy issues, we'd be free to point out perceived flaws in the founding arguments. We can't give religion a free pass on this, because we can't trust the religious to keep their beliefs to themselves.

As ever, Jesse

[pancreasman]

Thing is Hamster that there is a new brand of atheist in town and she ain't 'well-meaning' or interested in doing 'the right thing according to what they understand is right and wrong' In short they just don't give a hoot about any opinion but the one which they are ramming down our throats in much the same way that their painful predecessors the vapid and vicious reformed preachers that stormed the English countryside frightening the out of (or would that be into) everyone and sundry. It's a disease and it's not getting better, it's only design it to evangelize, propagate and destroy every memory of religion on this planet. (check my recent rant ;) )

Oh bring back the day when atheists were all nice people to be with.

Peace,
Eric.

Yay for over-generalizations.

[ZackMartin]

Thing is Hamster that there is a new brand of atheist in town and she ain't 'well-meaning' or interested in doing 'the right thing according to what they understand is right and wrong' In short they just don't give a hoot about any opinion but the one which they are ramming down our throats in much the same way that their painful predecessors the vapid and vicious reformed preachers that stormed the English countryside frightening the out of (or would that be into) everyone and sundry. It's a disease and it's not getting better, it's only design it to evangelize, propagate and destroy every memory of religion on this planet. (check my recent rant ;) ) Oh bring back the day when atheists were all nice people to be with.

Evangelical atheism makes logical sense. If you believe that atheism is rational and theism is irrational, then by converting people to atheism you are doing them a favour by making them more rational, which is a good thing. So you will want to do what you can to increase the number of atheists and decrease the number of theists.

So even though I'm not an atheist, I find it hard to begrudge their evangelical turn, since it just makes sense given their assumptions.

Zack

[headheart]

Dennett, in his entry statement: "Religions have contrived to make it impossible to disagree with them critically without being rude. They play the hurt feelings card at every opportunity."

Harris: "Physicists aren't offended when their view of physics is disproved or challenged."

So what is it that was so offensive about that video? It's just atheists speaking about their experiences, something Christians do in the natural course of events without so much as an eyeblink. Do you find the following offensive? Is it too much in your face?

AD_Minimal_Final.png

A bus ad nearly identical to the above, but including the url for American Atheists as well, was refused by County of Lackawanna Transit System (COLTS) in Scranton, PA. as too controversial. Christians, apparently, are offended by our mere existence.

Eric, we can't win here, and can only achieve a draw by hiding in our closets. Yes, we are challenging your belief in the supernatural, for what seem to us to be pressing reasons in the aftermath of 9/11. Without a shadow of a doubt, it was 9/11 (and 7/7) that spurred Dawkins to speak out against supernaturalist beliefs. Similarly, it was 9/11 that spurred me to begin interacting with supernaturalists, first with muslims, and then a few years later with Christians.

But if that was the proverbial straw, it was not the last to fall on the camel's back. Ya'll need a lot of watching. It's a continuing game of whack-a-mole punching down the fundamentalist eruptions that are forever attempting to remove biology from our American schools, to rewrite the religious history of the US, and most recently, to deny or restrict access to contraceptives and birth control.

In any other discussion of public policy issues, we'd be free to point out perceived flaws in the founding arguments. We can't give religion a free pass on this, because we can't trust the religious to keep their beliefs to themselves.

As ever, Jesse

Hi Jesse. How you been man?
You've certainly pulled out some top drawer apologetic arguments for me to address.
At the time of 9/11 I was embracing Calvinism and opted for Hyper-Calvinism which has an explanation for evil which I found was too cold for me. I had just come out of a decade of naturalism/atheism and did not want anything to do with 'supernatural' having had [15 years] years of being tossed up and down like a rag doll in very mystical off-shoot of Christianity (aka. Shepherding Movement followed by Word of Faith Movement) so my re-entry into Christianity was a very cautious one. Of course the Bible was worshipped and my brief sojourn in Baptist indoctrination did not help.
Eventually, I just did a lot of thinking and conversing with knowledgeable people and well escaped the Bible worship cult-type thinking which opened up the sky and simultaneously discovered that the supernatural experience is a piece of driftwood from a sinking ship and only an encumbrance to getting to know the Lord.
So when catastrophe hit me like a ton of bricks (and it sure came down in hailstones) I wasn't filled with answers but I was better able to find comfort in the Lord and out of that to be able to comfort others with the comfort I'd received.
I don't want to go to far and say it's all illusion but I think that there is more for me in Panentheism than I found in Theism.

Peace,
Eric.


Johnny Clegg - Great Heart (Music Video) Savuka

[headheart]

Evangelical atheism makes logical sense. If you believe that atheism is rational and theism is irrational, then by converting people to atheism you are doing them a favour by making them more rational, which is a good thing. So you will want to do what you can to increase the number of atheists and decrease the number of theists.

So even though I'm not an atheist, I find it hard to begrudge their evangelical turn, since it just makes sense given their assumptions.

Zack

Zack,
I can understand that line of reasoning but what I find weak about their arguments is the way they are presenting it. If they talked about non-supernatural alternatives instead of a denial of all religion then I'd be singing 'Hare Krishna' but the problem is that it's as cold as a stone. Even old George Harrison made more sense with his mystical rap. (refer his last interview - 1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50LfH0I879g 2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZYozQfn8a0 3. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxmG0R9S2Qg 4. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdSb4zddOzo ) It's just that having been a naturalist at a time when Christians thought I was a devil or worse (is there?) - reading Rudolph Steiner and taking my children out of mainstream Christian fundamentalist schools so they could get a chance to make a more open choice about their own pathways, much in the same way that my parents had done by not indoctrinating me with any religion.
I could rap on, but I think they're far to fanatical to create anything but more silly fanatics and well you know that's a bad pathway.

Peace.

1.

[Tassman]

Why don't you look it up seeing as it's right up your alley creep.

“Creep”!!!!

Conspiracy theory:

1. A theory that explains an event as being the result of a plot by a covert group or organization; a belief that a particular unexplained event was caused by such a group.

2. The idea that many important political events or economic and social trends are the products of secret plots that are largely unknown to the general public.

http://dictionary.reference.com/brow...spiracy+theory.

‘headheart’:

#32 “…new brand of atheist in town….they just don't give a hoot about any opinion but the one which they are ramming down our throats …..It's a disease and it's not getting better, it's only design it to evangelize, propagate and destroy every memory of religion on this planet”.

#34 This new breed of atheist (if one can even call it atheism) is a deliberate and calculated program…..”

See the similarities Eric, between your views and the mind-set of a conspiracy theorist?