Occupy leaders arrested for plot to blow up bridge

[JimL]

Is it possible for a person to be as clueless of basic psychology and sociology and still function in society as Jimmy does? Leaderless groups, lol and he believes that republicans believe in legends and myth.

You're showing yourselves to be the clueless ones, but keep going its entertaining to watch clueless high fiving their ignorance.

[Jaecp]

Organizer's aren't leaders.

They are just people that help get the details hashed out. Decisions are made by direct democracy at the GA's. Things that get brought to the GA are often the work of other committee's where anyone can join or leave at any time. Other stuff at the GA is just whatever someone wants to get voted on. You just find the guy whose currently holding the megaphone and ask to use it. There is usually a line of some sort. They can get kinda large sometimes. Even if people are doing a task, they aren't leaders, but people serving the group. When I started the info desk at Occupy Portland I wasn't a leader, not in any real sense of the word, but just some guy getting people to draw maps of the park in sharpie while I fielded questions from people who wanted to know where stuff was or where they could volunteer or donate stuff at.

I gotta say Jim, I wish these people would have just gone to the occupations and seen them for themselves. The energy, the creativity, the crowdsourced way of making a better future, it was nifty

[lilpixieofterror]

Right pix, Adbusters has nothing to do with the occupy movement other than providing a spark. Adbusters is a magazine. If your claim is that a magazine is the leader of occupy, then prove it. Does Adbusters fund Occupy? Do they organize leadership roles for the different Occupys, you know, all these leaders that you can't find? Do they orchestrate the activities of Occupy? What do they do Lilpix?

Again Jimmy, have you bothered to read anything? That is from the Adbusters web site, but since you like to ignore evidence that disagrees with you, here is yet another one:

Antecedents for Occupy Wall Street (OWS) include the British student protests of 2010, as well as Greek and Spanish anti-austerity protests of the "indignados" (indignants) (2011–2012 Spanish protests starting 15 May 2011), along with the Arab Spring protests.[6] OWS was initiated by Kalle Lasn and Micah White of Adbusters, a Canadian anti-consumerist publication, who conceived of an June 2011 occupation in lower Manhattan. Lasn registered the OccupyWallSteet.org web address on June 9th.[7] In June Adbusters emailed its subscribers saying “America needs its own Tahrir”. White said the reception of the idea "snowballed from there".[8][7] In a blog post on July 13 of 2011,[9] Adbusters proposed a peaceful occupation of Wall Street to protest corporate influence on democracy, the lack of legal consequences for those who brought about the global crisis of monetary insolvency, and an increasing disparity in wealth.[8] The protest was promoted with an image featuring a dancer atop Wall Street's iconic Charging Bull statue.[10][11][12]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupy_Wall_Street

Deny... deny... deny is your usual mode of operation, eh?

Thank you for proving my point lilpix, you haven't a clue. This is all you could dig up on the web, an occupier like any other occupier who interviewed with non other than propagandist Shawn Hannity of Fox. Shawn Hannity calling him an organizer, you know, because thats what Hannity does, does not make him an organizer. And this other guy, David Graeber, he took it upon himself you say, to write about occupy, and writing about occupy makes him and organizer. Really pix, thats all you could come up with to back up your claim? Now why don't you go and see if you can find who is behind the Tea Party Groups, I think you may have a little more luck with that assignment. I can tell you who they are if you like, and who funds and orchestrates them?

Yep, still ignoring the psychological and sociological elements of how people and groups works. You ignored my questions again so let me re post them in big bold letter so you'll answer them this time instead of just ignoring them: and dishonestly editing them out cause you can't answer them:

Do you think that their planned rally in May was just made up out of the blue or were there people behind it that helped to organize it? Do you think bus routes just appear out of nowhere? Do you think rallies just organizes themselves? Do you think meetings of this scale just happened on a whim or was it somebodies idea and it was implemented later on as the idea begin to take forum and grow?
Do you think that nobody is in charge of the money OWS gets and nobody decides where to spend it and where not to spend it?
Do you think nobody is in charge of keeping the kitchen's in order or do you think chaos works in a kitchen that feeds lots of people?
If there is no spokesmen, why do they have TV interviews in which they are introduced as some sort of leader within the movement?
If they are 'leaderless', why do they need to lease a space and why are people within the OWS movement trying to get the guys name removed if they are so leaderless?

Answer the questions or are you going to ignore evidence again that disagrees with your propaganda and also, what is The New York City General Assembly and what do they for OWS?

[lilpixieofterror]

Organizer's aren't leaders.

This should be entertaining...

They are just people that help get the details hashed out. Decisions are made by direct democracy at the GA's. Things that get brought to the GA are often the work of other committee's where anyone can join or leave at any time. Other stuff at the GA is just whatever someone wants to get voted on. You just find the guy whose currently holding the megaphone and ask to use it. There is usually a line of some sort. They can get kinda large sometimes. Even if people are doing a task, they aren't leaders, but people serving the group. When I started the info desk at Occupy Portland I wasn't a leader, not in any real sense of the word, but just some guy getting people to draw maps of the park in sharpie while I fielded questions from people who wanted to know where stuff was or where they could volunteer or donate stuff at.

So you're saying that organizers do not:

- make decisions about where things will be placed or how they will be placed?
- get permits, look into local laws, look into any other requirements for the group?
- help to find transportation if required?
- sign anything that needs to be signed?
- make decisions for the group as a whole?
- do interviews for news groups such as CNN, Fox, or MSNBC?

Funny, that is the same thing that leaders in a business or the military does. Yet for some magical reason, when applied to OWS it means there is no leaders even though they make decisions for the group, sign things for the group, and speak on behalf of the group. Keep up with the entertainment and ignoring evidence that you dislike.

I gotta say Jim, I wish these people would have just gone to the occupations and seen them for themselves. The energy, the creativity, the crowdsourced way of making a better future, it was nifty

We had a one where I lived, went to it, and didn't find it that impressive. I know group dynmacis, psychology, basic logic, and sociology Jaecp and I know that it is impossible for there to be any sort of movement without any sort of leadership. Sure you can deny that an organizer is not a leader, but it is too bad that when somebody calls the shots, makes decisions, looks into local laws, determines were protest will be held, etc that makes them a leader by any definition of the word by the one that OWSers seem to use.

[lilpixieofterror]

You're showing yourselves to be the clueless ones, but keep going its entertaining to watch clueless high fiving their ignorance.

Thus sayeth the same person that simply ignores my questions and dishonestly cuts up my post so those questions he can't answer and the evidence back my position with isn't in it. Again, you're sold on your own propaganda, eh?

[Cow Poke]

[The Moonshield]

More news on the bomb plot:

Dozens of members of Occupy Cleveland showed up at a Cleveland courthouse to support the five people charged in connection with an alleged plot to blow up a northeast Ohio bridge.

...

In all, about 50 members of the Occupy Cleveland group went into courthouse. After the arrests were made, Occupy Cleveland said the five suspects were associated with the group, but they were “in no way representing or acting on behalf of Occupy Cleveland.”

Link.

Repeat question: If there's no membership, no registration, and anyone can show up, be a part of the group, and have an equal voice in this leaderless, "everybody's equal" movement, how can anyone claim that these men weren't "representing or acting on behalf of Occupy Cleveland?" How can anyone say with any authority that their personal non-violent methods are more "official" or "valid" than these guy's bomb plot?

[Cow Poke]

More news on the bomb plot:



Link.

Repeat question: If there's no membership, no registration, and anyone can show up, be a part of the group, and have an equal voice in this leaderless, "everybody's equal" movement, how can anyone claim that these men weren't "representing or acting on behalf of Occupy Cleveland?" How can anyone say with any authority that their personal non-violent methods are more "official" or "valid" than these guy's bomb plot?

Wow, you're a real BUZZKILL, Moon! Bringing in actual FACTS and stuff!

[rogue06]

I know full well who they are, and the point is that it doesn't matter. Adbusters did not organize and is not orchestrating the Occupy movement. The Tea Party on the other hand is organized, funded, and orchestrated, or in other words manipulated by outside forces whose agendas are kept hidden from their naive recruits. I asked because lilpixie brought it up infering that they had some leadership role within the movement. They don't.

Too bad the facts aren't with you on this. Even the left openly acknowledges AdBusters role in creating and orchestrating the OWS movement (though it grew beyond what they or anyone else could control) whereas the Koch Brothers (who liberals point to as funding the Tea Party) didn't get involved until shortly before the 2010 election nearly 1¾ years after the Tea Party got started.

[rogue06]

Here's a test for you Jimmy-me-boy... I'll post TWO pictures... which one do you think is more likely to be OWS?

Attachment 76005Attachment 76006

Reminds me of the following

guide to protestors.jpg

[rogue06]

Okay, show me how they're behind OWS rogue.

Since you somehow missed this...

But let's get back to the group that dreamt up the Occupy movement, AdBusters.

Exploring Occupy Wall Street's 'Adbuster' Origins

The protests go by a variety of names: "Occupy Wall Street," "American Autumn," "The 99 Percent." And the lack of a unified message is matched by a lack of centralized control. But the protests share a common spark: a disillusioned Canadian adman.

The Occupy protests seemed to come out of nowhere. But the early participants, like John Garcia in downtown Seattle, point to a very specific catalyst.

"I get Adbusters, so that's how I heard about it," he says.


Source

© source where applicable

Under the photograph it states that "the demonstrations were inspired by a blog post by Kalle Lasn, founder of Adbusters magazine."

The last sentence of the story is "And as the continuing scene in lower Manhattan attests, Lasn certainly knows how to launch a campaign."

After Igniting Wall St. Protests, Magazine Proposes One Clear Demand

Three months ago, the Canadian magazine Adbusters called for a protest on Wall Street, providing the spark that began a wildfire of protest across the country and, over the weekend, in an increasing number of cities around the world.


Source

© source where applicable

Adbusters founders cheer their Occupy idea

With roots that reach as far as Cairo's fertile Tahrir Square, the Occupy protests roiling Wall Street will finally come full circle this weekend as they blossom in Canada, where they were conceived by Vancouver-based Adbusters.


Source

© source where applicable

The Branding of the Occupy Movement

Kalle Lasn, the longtime editor of the anticonsumerist magazine Adbusters, did not invent the anger that has been feeding the Occupy Wall Street demonstrations across the United States.

But he did brand it.

Last summer, as uprisings shook the Middle East and much of the world economy struggled, Mr. Lasn and several colleagues at the small magazine felt the moment was ripe to tap simmering frustration on the American political left.

On July 13, he and his colleagues created a new hash tag on Twitter: #OCCUPYWALLSTREET. They made a poster showing a ballerina dancing on the back of the muscular sculptured bull near Wall Street in Manhattan.

For some people they were just words and images. For Mr. Lasn, they were tools to begin remodeling the “mental environment,” to create a new “meme,” the term coined by the evolutionary biologist Richard Dawkins for a kind of transcendent cultural message.


Source

© source where applicable

And note the sources, it isn't Fox News reporting this.

[Cow Poke]

Reminds me of the following

Yeah, me too, but I also seem to remember it got modded because of the phraseology pointing to her hat.

[rogue06]

Which makes me wonder where the police were.

Often they and rescue workers would get attacked by protesters when they entered the encampments in order to help someone. There's a thread here on Tweb covering the protests as they took place where I documented instances of this again and again.

And then, like after the rape in Zuccotti Park, some times the protesters would shoo the attacker away (leaving him to go rape again) rather than call the police.

[rogue06]

Yeah, me too, but I also seem to remember it got modded because of the phraseology pointing to her hat.

Oh fiddle sticks. And IIRC some nice green with a Texas accent altered it for me. [*Bats eyes*]

[rogue06]

I know the OWSers like to claim to be leaderless

Purely as a ploy to escape legal responsibility. But then, it seems like most of them have spent a good deal of time trying to escape responsibility.