Should a Religion have Private, Personal, Sacred Practices?

[Cow Poke]

Bull o ney. They join precisely because they want more of what they see and feel.

Pardon me for doubting your all-knowingness, OC, but I hardly believe you know why EVERY SINGLE PERSON has joined your Church.

Some even join because they are impressed with the doctrine of eternal family relationships that the temple is all about.

Yeah, and some join to keep their spouses happy in THIS life.

Hey, I don't even know all there is to know about the temple, and I was born into the Church. But one thing I know, and that is that the learning never ceases.

Well, yeah, cause your doctrines and teachings keep changing! According to the article on the Reconstruction of Mormon Doctrine, you guys even believe in the TRINITY at one time!

[nrajeff]

So Christians were wrong to have practiced their beliefs in the open and allowing the Romans and others to mock them?...

Some sources say that the early Christians were so secretive about their meetings (they also had a secret code for identifying a fellow Christian) because they were doing subversive and/or depraved things in those meetings.

[Cow Poke]

Some sources say that the early Christians were so secretive about their meetings (they also had a secret code for identifying a fellow Christian) because they were doing subversive and/or depraved things in those meetings.

And some sources say Elvis was at 7-11 with Michael Jackson.

[OtherCheek]

And some sources say Elvis was at 7-11 with Michael Jackson.

And some sources say that Joseph Smith was corrupt.

[Cow Poke]

Some sources say that the early Christians were so secretive about their meetings (they also had a secret code for identifying a fellow Christian)

Jesus had just been crucified, and other Christians were being martyred. The Roman government in particular was, depending upon the Emperor and locale, persecuting Christians. That is, of course, what Saul was doing before his Damascus Road Experience. So, yeah, there was a lot of "hiding" going on, and I'd even call it "secret" stuff.

because they were doing subversive and/or depraved things in those meetings.

I don't know about "depraved", but some of the Emperors saw Christianity as quite different from other religions and "gods" they "inherited" when they conquered other lands. They just seemed to give the new gods Roman names and add them to the collection. Rather than "piety" (pietas), however, the Romans saw Christianity as "superstition" (superstitio), and a threat to their empire.

AND, it's recorded in the Bible that some of the disciples and women followed or watched Jesus "from afar off" as the crucifixion scene was unfolding. So, yeah... in that intense atmosphere of persecution and uncertainty, there was caution.

[Cow Poke]

And some sources say that Joseph Smith was corrupt.

Well, yeah, but there's more evidence for that than for Elvis and Michael Jackson being together at 7-11.

[OtherCheek]

Jesus had just been crucified, and other Christians were being martyred. The Roman government in particular was, depending upon the Emperor and locale, persecuting Christians. That is, of course, what Saul was doing before his Damascus Road Experience. So, yeah, there was a lot of "hiding" going on, and I'd even call it "secret" stuff.

I don't know about "depraved", but some of the Emperors saw Christianity as quite different from other religions and "gods" they "inherited" when they conquered other lands. They just seemed to give the new gods Roman names and add them to the collection. Rather than "piety" (pietas), however, the Romans saw Christianity as "superstition" (superstitio), and a threat to their empire.

AND, it's recorded in the Bible that some of the disciples and women followed or watched Jesus "from afar off" as the crucifixion scene was unfolding. So, yeah... in that intense atmosphere of persecution and uncertainty, there was caution.

Some critics might say that such secretiveness and hiding indicated a lack of a willingness to put their light "on a candlestick."

[Cow Poke]

Some critics might say that such secretiveness and hiding indicated a lack of a willingness to put their light "on a candlestick."

Yes, OC, and then there's the glowing testimony (literally) of those who died being burned alive or eaten by lions. There are some phenomenal stories of Christians who stepped forward and allowed themselves to be martyred, praising God as they died.

[OtherCheek]

Yes, OC, and then there's the glowing testimony (literally) of those who died being burned alive or eaten by lions. There are some phenomenal stories of Christians who stepped forward and allowed themselves to be martyred, praising God as they died.

Like Joseph and Hyrum Smith, and Saints in Missouri who were killed and had an extermination order issued against them, and driven out and their property taken. And those driven out of their homes and property in Nauvoo and the temple desecrated.

Yes. I agree.

[Cow Poke]

Like Joseph and Hyrum Smith, and Saints in Missouri who were killed and had an extermination order issued against them, and driven out and their property taken.

Ah, you mean the shootout at Carthage Jail at the hands of a mob consisting AT LEAST IN PART of Smith's own former followers, when Smith claimed to be going "like a lamb to the slaughter", but allowed himself to be armed with a gun, and allegedly sent instructions as Lt General of his militia for his guys to ride in and rescue him.... THAT Joseph Smith?

You have Martyrdom Envy, OC.

And those driven out of their homes and property in Nauvoo and the temple desecrated.

That was a horrible thing, and should not have happened. I don't think ANY of us approve of that kind of violence. OR the violence at Far West, which seemed to involve quite a few more of YOUR people on both sides than you like to admit.

Yes. I agree.

Good.

[One Bad Pig]

Some sources say that the early Christians were so secretive about their meetings (they also had a secret code for identifying a fellow Christian) because they were doing subversive and/or depraved things in those meetings.

Sort of. We know that Christians were accused of doing depraved things in their meetings because we have Christian rebuttals of such accusations. Christianity was thought of as being subversive because they refused to worship Caesar and because they used words for Jesus that were otherwise used for Caesar like "Lord" and "Savior."

[Cow Poke]

We know that Christians were accused of doing depraved things in their meetings because we have Christian rebuttals of such accusations.

I kinda sorta remembered something like this, but wasn't sure. Linky?

[Sparko]

Some sources say that the early Christians were so secretive about their meetings (they also had a secret code for identifying a fellow Christian) because they were doing subversive and/or depraved things in those meetings.

Hiding for your life is different than keeping secret rituals. anyone who was interested in Christianity can know everything about it by either reading the scriptures, or asking a believer. They didn't keep secrets from people until they were initiated.

[OtherCheek]

Hiding for your life is different than keeping secret rituals. anyone who was interested in Christianity can know everything about it by either reading the scriptures, or asking a believer. They didn't keep secrets from people until they were initiated.

How about the actual experience of being "indwelt" before they were actually "indwelt"? Maybe there is a small percentage of orthodox Christians who would not have joined up if they beforehand knew what it was like to be indwelt equal to the small percentage of LDS would not have joined up if they had experienced beforehand the temple ceremonies.

[Sparko]

How about the actual experience of being "indwelt" before they were actually "indwelt"? Maybe there is a small percentage of orthodox Christians who would not have joined up if they beforehand knew what it was like to be indwelt equal to the small percentage of LDS would not have joined up if they had experienced beforehand the temple ceremonies.