The Problem of Evil

[OtherCheek]

If mankind has to "work" to be saved, then what purpose does the atonement serve? Christ would have died in vain if humans had to work for their salvation. The purpose of the Atonement was to present those who follow and believe in Christ blameless and righteous before God. If I have to work for that, I will never achieve it. No matter how "good" I try to be, I cannot measure up to the requirements of the Law of God.

I am currently fighting cancer. I have been for almost 2 years now. It is a life and death struggle at times and I have been very near death several times. At times it is "all I can do" to hold on, to cling to life, to show a brave face to my children and my wife, to trust God that he knows what he is doing, to trust that God loves me though I have suffered a great deal at times, to keep hope alive though so many hopes have been dashed. But after all this, after I can do and have done and all my struggling, I know for a fact, like I know the feel of the sun on my face, that it is by His grace that I am yet alive, and if I remain on this earth to finish raising my family, and seeing them through the difficulties of their formative years, it will by the grace of God, in the final analysis, that my life is spared as I would desire it to be.

Similarly, after all my spiritual struggling, my repentance, my impatience and my patience, my frustrations and my peace, my service to my family, my prayers, by expressions of love to family and loved ones, my expression of love to my Father in Heaven, my appreciation for Jesus Christ and his atonement, my charities, my bearing witness of God's power, etc. After all these things that I can do and have done, and continue to do, yet in the final analysis, I know for a fact that it is by God's Grace that I am saved.

[jethrorlz]

I am very sorry for the struggles you are currently going through. My mother had fought breast cancer so I know what it is like, to some degree, to watch a loved one suffer. My biggest concern for Mormons is know who Jesus Christ is and who he is not. In the Mormon faith, who is Jesus Christ? Is he a god or is he God. Christian doctrine teaches One God, one essence, three persons: God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit(Ghost). As I understand it, Mormons teach three gods. Father god, Jesus Christ who is a god, and Holy Ghost who is another god. Is this true? I do not want to assume, but I see you keep quoting the Book of Mormon so I assume you are a Mormon. Jesus Christ is the center to what we both believe, but our beliefs of him are very different; a difference that may affect our eternity.

[Cow Poke]

I am currently fighting cancer. I have been for almost 2 years now.

I pray for you nearly every day, OC. You are often on my mind at weird times, and I take time to pray for you and your family. I don't pretend to know exactly what you or your family needs, but Jesus does.

[OtherCheek]

I am very sorry for the struggles you are currently going through. My mother had fought breast cancer so I know what it is like, to some degree, to watch a loved one suffer. My biggest concern for Mormons is know who Jesus Christ is and who he is not. In the Mormon faith, who is Jesus Christ? Is he a god or is he God. Christian doctrine teaches One God, one essence, three persons: God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit(Ghost). As I understand it, Mormons teach three gods. Father god, Jesus Christ who is a god, and Holy Ghost who is another god. Is this true? I do not want to assume, but I see you keep quoting the Book of Mormon so I assume you are a Mormon. Jesus Christ is the center to what we both believe, but our beliefs of him are very different; a difference that may affect our eternity.

Thanks for that, Jethro.

Yes. I am LDS (Mormon).

LDS people believe in God the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost. God the Father is God. His Son Jesus Christ is God with a capital "G". They are one. The Holy Ghost is also God with a capital "G". The three of them are one God. But the meaning of the word "ONE" is viewed differently between LDS and Trinitarian Christians. The difference is that the LDS people don't believe they are one "essence". They each have their own minds, thoughts, and are separable one from another. What makes them "ONE" is the fact that they are united in the same purpose, work, and cause. In love, in harmony with each other, in compassion, in patience, temperance, kindness, in justice, in mercy, and in all attributes of perfection. They are ONE in every single conceivable way, and every inconceivable way except that they are not of the same "essence" as that word is defined in the orthodox creeds.

It is correct that our beliefs of Jesus Christ have many differences. But there are also many similarities. We teach that there is no other name under heaven, and no other means whereby mankind may be saved, except by believing upon the name, and following Jesus Christ and his Gospel.

Helaman 5:12
And now, my sons, remember, remember that it is upon the rock of our Redeemer, who is Christ, the Son of God, that ye must build your foundation; that when the devil shall send forth his mighty winds, yea, his shafts in the whirlwind, yea, when all his hail and his mighty storm shall beat upon you, it shall have no power over you to drag you down to the gulf of misery and endless wo, because of the rock upon which ye are built, which is a sure foundation, a foundation whereon if men build they cannot fall.

Mormons stress belief and works. But mostly we believe that it is ultimately through the power of the Atonement and Jesus Christ that we can be saved---even after all our doing and believing.

Similarly, orthodox Christians stress belief. They believe that it is ultimately through the power of the Atonement and Jesus Christ that they can be saved---even after all their believing.

[Cow Poke]

Similarly, orthodox Christians stress belief. They believe that it is ultimately through the power of the Atonement and Jesus Christ that they can be saved---even after all their believing.

And our "works" are BECAUSE we believe and are saved.

[jethrorlz]

I will agree that there are similarities, but the differences create a canyon that cannot be bridged. Do you believe that the Book of Mormon and the Bible are both equally inspired works, equal revelations from God?

I agree. We are saved because we have faith. It is our faith that produces good works. Our faith does not come from good works.

Ephesians 2:8-9 - For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith —and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.

[OtherCheek]

And our "works" are BECAUSE we believe and are saved.

Would it be correct to say that orthodoxy teaches that believing precedes salvation, and salvation precedes works?

Even so, it is by Grace that you are saved after all you can believe.

[Cow Poke]

Would it be correct to say that orthodoxy teaches that believing precedes salvation, and salvation precedes works?

Even so, it is by Grace that you are saved after all you can believe.

It would be better to leave it at "for by grace are we saved through faith"

[OtherCheek]

I will agree that there are similarities, but the differences create a canyon that cannot be bridged. Do you believe that the Book of Mormon and the Bible are both equally inspired works, equal revelations from God?

Yes.

I agree. We are saved because we have faith. It is our faith that produces good works. Our faith does not come from good works.

I believe they feed off each other. Good works brings the blessings of heaven, one of which is greater faith. Faith in turn motivates us to do good works.

Ephesians 2:8-9 - For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith —and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.

No understanding LDS person boasts that their own good works will save them, any more than any understanding orthodox Christian would boast that their own good faith will save them.

In the final analysis, it is through the Atonement of Jesus Christ that all mankind may be saved. Neither our believing nor our works has the power to do this.

[jethrorlz]

What makes Mormonism different from every other religion in the entire world? Why Mormonism?

[OtherCheek]

What makes Mormonism different from every other religion in the entire world? Why Mormonism?

It is reported that on one occasion, when the Prophet Joseph Smith was asked, "Wherein [the LDS Church] differed from the other religions of the day," he replied, that it was in "the gift of the Holy Ghost by the laying-on of hands,…[and] that all other considerations were contained in the gift of the Holy Ghost" (HC 4:42).

Now there are other differences, obviously. You can probably best note these for yourself by reading the Church's 13 Articles of Faith

[jethrorlz]

Okay, but is there anything unique about Mormonism? I mean, it claims to have the truth, just like any other religion in the world. It has its doctrines and its teachings, but what makes it different? Is there anything unique that Mormonism offers that no other religion does?

[OtherCheek]

Okay, but is there anything unique about Mormonism? I mean, it claims to have the truth, just like any other religion in the world. It has its doctrines and its teachings, but what makes it different? Is there anything unique that Mormonism offers that no other religion does?

Exaltation. Eternal Marriage. Eternal Progression. Eternal Families. Eternal Progeny.

[jethrorlz]

Do Mormons believe in universal salvation?

[OtherCheek]

Do Mormons believe in universal salvation?

It would help if you press the "quote" button instead of the "reply" button when replying.

Please define "Universal Salvation" as you perceive the term.