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Thread: Commentary Thread: Is the Bible Inspired by God

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    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hakeem View Post
    However, the fact is that contradictions, flaws and errors exist in the Bible.
    None of those contradictions, flaws or errors as they now exist can be shown to be from the original autographs of said God-breathed documents.

    Your example:
    Quote Originally Posted by Hakeem View Post
    1. How old was Ahaziah when he began to rule over Jerusalem?

    (a) Twenty-two (2 Kings 8:26)
    (b) Forty-two (2 Chronicles 22:2)
    It is obvious that one of the readings in the Hebrew text is wrong.

    Without giving you any further explanation, the original reading has been deduced to be the one as found in 2 Kings 8:26. The reading forty-two in Hebrew of 2 Chronicles 22:2 is the reading which was the corrupted text. In 2 Chronicles 22:2 the NIV and NASB give the reading, "twenty-two."
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  2. #12
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by 37818 View Post
    None of those contradictions, flaws or errors as they now exist can be shown to be from the original autographs of said God-breathed documents.


    My response is that contradictions/errors must not exist in an inspired book of God according to 1 Corinthians 14:33 and Proverbs 30:5. How these contradictions came about is not my debate with you.

    Your example:


    It is obvious that one of the readings in the Hebrew text is wrong.

    Without giving you any further explanation, the original reading has been deduced to be the one as found in 2 Kings 8:26. The reading forty-two in Hebrew of 2 Chronicles 22:2 is the reading which was the corrupted text. In 2 Chronicles 22:2 the NIV and NASB give the reading, "twenty-two."
    Thank you for admitting that there is wrong reading and hence cannot be inspired by God.

    As I said, we are not debating the reasons behind these contradictions originated.

    In addition, we do not have the orginal manuscripts. What we have are copies of copies of copies of these manuscripts and no two copies are same.

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    tWebber tabibito's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 37818 View Post
    None of those contradictions, flaws or errors as they now exist can be shown to be from the original autographs of said God-breathed documents.

    Your example:


    It is obvious that one of the readings in the Hebrew text is wrong.

    Without giving you any further explanation, the original reading has been deduced to be the one as found in 2 Kings 8:26. The reading forty-two in Hebrew of 2 Chronicles 22:2 is the reading which was the corrupted text. In 2 Chronicles 22:2 the NIV and NASB give the reading, "twenty-two."
    Interesting: even the "Answers in Genesis" site doesn't make any assertions about this one. https://answersingenesis.org/bible-t...-ages-at-once/
    και εκζητησατε με και ευρησετε με οτι ζητησετε με εν ολη καρδία υμων

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    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by tabibito View Post
    Interesting: even the "Answers in Genesis" site doesn't make any assertions about this one. https://answersingenesis.org/bible-t...-ages-at-once/
    It is worth noticing that solutions have been developed to address this contradiction between 2 Kings 8:26 and 2 Chronicles 22:2. To this effect, Adam Clark Commentary says on 2 Kings 8:26 "After all, here is a most manifest contradiction, that cannot be removed but by having recourse to violent modes of solution."

    Source: https://www.studylight.org/commentar...2-kings-8.html

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    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hakeem View Post
    Thank you for admitting that there is wrong reading and hence cannot be inspired by God.
    So are you saying because the copies contain the error that its original was not the God-breathed text?
    As I said, we are not debating the reasons behind these contradictions originated.
    Where? The debate was over the Bible being inspired by God.
    In addition, we do not have the original manuscripts. What we have are copies of copies of copies of these manuscripts and no two copies are same.
    Not anyone claimed any individual copy to be inspired by God. Nor that any translation is for that matter. God has preserved the whole of His word. To deny what God has preserved in the written copies is to deny God and His word.
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

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    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tabibito View Post
    Interesting: even the "Answers in Genesis" site doesn't make any assertions about this one. https://answersingenesis.org/bible-t...-ages-at-once/
    What follows cannot both be true with both "twenty two years" and "forty two years."
    2 Kings 8:26,
    . . . old [was] Ahaziah when he began to reign; and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. . . .

    2 Chronicles 22:2,
    . . . old [was] Ahaziah when he began to reign, and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. . . .
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

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    tWebber Roy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 37818
    The reading forty-two in Hebrew of 2 Chronicles 22:2 is the reading which was the corrupted text.
    God has preserved the whole of His word.
    That's obviously not true, since (as you've just admitted) 2 Chr 22 hasn't been preserved.

    If the text hadn't been duplicated in 2K, we might never know that the '42' was wrong. So how many other corrupted texts might there be? How many other mistranscribed numbers have become fixed? You can't be sure.
    To deny what God has preserved in the written copies is to deny God and His word.
    So by admitting that 2 Chr 22 became corrupted, you've just denied your god.
    Starlight: "In America a lot of tap-water is contaminated with lead or chemicals from fracking, because the right-wing crazies are anti-regulation."
    Lilpixieoferror: "Another day another Starlight fable. What actually causes high lead levels in water is lead pipes or lead solder, not industrial waste from any source. Well, so much for this Starlight fable... I wonder what tomorrow’s made up story will be in his ‘I HATE AMERICAN CHRISTIANS!!!’ quest."

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    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roy View Post
    That's obviously not true, since (as you've just admitted) 2 Chr 22 hasn't been preserved.
    I admitted no such thing. It is preserved. The fact that other ancient translations and Darby translation, NIV and NASB translate 2 Chronicles 22:2 to read "twenty two."
    If the text hadn't been duplicated in 2K, we might never know that the '42' was wrong. So how many other corrupted texts might there be? How many other mistranscribed numbers have become fixed? You can't be sure.So by admitting that 2 Chr 22 became corrupted, you've just denied your god.
    Not at all (Proverbs 30:5-6). That variant for one has been know of centuries. And such known textual corruptions are not uncommon.
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  9. #19
    tWebber
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    1) 31787 writing "So are you saying because the copies contain the error that its original was not the God-breathed text?" needs to be clarified; saying there is a copyist error to solve the contradictions , for example, between 2 Chronicles 22:2 and 2 kings 8:26 is just unsupported claim because we donot have access to the original manuscripts of the Bible in particular Kings and Chronicles in order to verify such claim.

    2 ) I wrote that as I said, we are not debating the reasons behind these contradictions originated.

    The answer to your question "Where?" is in my statement found in the debate some which I quoted below for your east reference;

    " However, the fact is that contradictions, flaws and errors exist in the Bible."

    So we are debating if the Bible is inspired by God and if it was preserved.

    As I said, a book of God cannot have contradictions in. How these contradictions got in the Bible is not our debate.

  10. #20
    tWebber
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    The following statement was in the previous above post and it should read as follows (in capital letters);

    "So we are debating if the Bible is inspired by God and NOT if it was preserved."

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