Announcement

Collapse

Civics 101 Guidelines

Want to argue about politics? Healthcare reform? Taxes? Governments? You've come to the right place!

Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
See more
See less

Trump: No Transgenders In The Military!

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #61
    Sure, it's an opinion piece....

    It's still unclear how exactly President Trump will formalize his decision to ban transgender individuals from serving in the military in any capacity. In the future, he should make things clear, direct, and formal before tweeting like a millennial from the hip (but the world should be full of unicorns too, so life is full of disappointments). But if the tweets from Wednesday eventually take the form of an executive order, Trump made the right decision, however impulsive it was and unpopular it may sound.

    The U.S. military has one goal: Protect and defend. Or as Article 1 section 8 of the Constitution reads, "to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions."

    The goal of the military is not a social experiment; it's not even to see who is the most patriotic. (I'm a patriot but I couldn't physically do what's required of many of our service people.) Its job is not to see if men and women can both do the same amount of push-ups, or if a woman can hold up in a unit of mostly men without interrupting the männerbund, or if a woman who identifies as a man can drag a 170-pound male away from heavy gun fire.

    Its job is not to pay for people to have elective surgeries so they feel more like a woman or a man.

    While trans activists, including Caitlyn Jenner, are understandably upset about the ban, many members of the military who have seen active combat both support transgenders and agree with Trump's decision, not because they are mean, old-fashioned bigots but because they view the active recognition of transgenders in the military as more of a petri dish of social experiments, wrapped in a progressive agenda.

    There may be a place for that -- the military is not that place.


    The liberals have used our public school classroom for social engineering and experimentation -- that was bad enough. We don't need that in our military.
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

    Comment


    • #62
      The transgenders will still be the in the military. If Trump succeeds, they'll still join and bravely serve the country, they'll just be quiet about what they're going through.

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
        The transgenders will still be the in the military. If Trump succeeds, they'll still join and bravely serve the country, they'll just be quiet about what they're going through.
        kinda hard hiding that you are taking hormones or have surgical scars (if they have done the operations) from the military doctors given that they have to undergo rigorous physicals and tests all the time.

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
          The transgenders will still be the in the military. If Trump succeeds, they'll still join and bravely serve the country, they'll just be quiet about what they're going through.
          How many people "transition" after entering the military? I noted that one of the main objections was cost, and there would obviously be a cost in medical procedures, recuperation, and "time off" from active duty.
          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by Sparko View Post
            kinda hard hiding that you are taking hormones or have surgical scars (if they have done the operations) from the military doctors given that they have to undergo rigorous physicals and tests all the time.
            You assume all transgenders have transitioned by that time? People enter the army at a rather young age.

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
              Thanks for the touch up Adrift, I'll return to the Church Fathers to see what they wrote on it.
              You might want to start with Clement of Alexandria.

              Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
              I still think its a mistake to interpret it as men acting like women. Unless by that you mean that's its a virtue for women to be cowards. That this is an essential and defining characteristic of women, that these men are seen as imitating. It still appears to retain the grain that its to shy away from challenge, to be coward-like, etc... To be in the eyes of the Greek 'unmanly'. That men acting like women is also unmanly I'm not going to contest. I just don't think its the point of the word.
              Huh? What do you mean, "Unless by that you mean that's its a virtue for women to be cowards." Where are you getting that?

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
                You assume all transgenders have transitioned by that time? People enter the army at a rather young age.
                Exactly, which brings up the question - is it really the military's job to cater to their gender confusion? If the transition happens "on company time", they are most certainly impacting unit readiness.
                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                  How many people "transition" after entering the military? I noted that one of the main objections was cost, and there would obviously be a cost in medical procedures, recuperation, and "time off" from active duty.
                  They have to keep taking hormones for the rest of their life. Hormones can cause a lot of emotional problems.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                    How many people "transition" after entering the military?
                    I don't have any good statistics on this, and in general statistics about any things regarding either transgender people or homosexuals, is very hard to get and is often subject to a lot of caveats. There have been plenty of veteran transgender people, of this there is absolutely no doubt. I wish you guys would look at their service records.

                    I personally wouldn't speak so badly about soldiers who've served, are serving or in training to serve their country, but maybe that's just me.

                    I noted that one of the main objections was cost, and there would obviously be a cost in medical procedures, recuperation, and "time off" from active duty.
                    Doesn't the VA pay like eighty million dollars for treating erectile dysfunction in veterans? That's supposedly ten times more than what the army every spent on transgenders, so the cost doesn't seem to be an objection. And the US Military with its overbloated, ridiculously balooned budgets, is not one to talk. Trump layered on another two hundred billion per year in his budget proposal. The amount used on transgenders would be... 0.01% of that.

                    The real reason Trump is doing this has nothing to do with morality, or budgets. I'm too cynical to believe that.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                      You might want to start with Clement of Alexandria.
                      I do remember him saying a bit about it, but getting something definitional is always hard.

                      Huh? What do you mean, "Unless by that you mean that's its a virtue for women to be cowards." Where are you getting that?
                      You don't think that effeminacy at all means lacking in strength or character, as St. Thomas Aquinas layed it out in his Summa Theologica? That's its only about men dressing like women, and acting like women?

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
                        I don't have any good statistics on this, and in general statistics about any things regarding either transgender people or homosexuals, is very hard to get and is often subject to a lot of caveats. There have been plenty of veteran transgender people, of this there is absolutely no doubt. I wish you guys would look at their service records.

                        I personally wouldn't speak so badly about soldiers who've served, are serving or in training to serve their country, but maybe that's just me.



                        Doesn't the VA pay like eighty million dollars for treating erectile dysfunction in veterans? That's supposedly ten times more than what the army every spent on transgenders, so the cost doesn't seem to be an objection. And the US Military with its overbloated, ridiculously balooned budgets, is not one to talk. Trump layered on another two hundred billion per year in his budget proposal. The amount used on transgenders would be... 0.01% of that.

                        The real reason Trump is doing this has nothing to do with morality, or budgets. I'm too cynical to believe that.
                        Did trump even mention the medical costs? I thought he was talking about the disturbance and distraction factors?

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                          Exactly, which brings up the question - is it really the military's job to cater to their gender confusion? If the transition happens "on company time", they are most certainly impacting unit readiness.
                          The military caters to the medical needs of all military personel and the costs for viagra alone in the military far outwieghs the costs of transgender issues. Funny, never heard any of you complaining about that. Why don't you just tell the truth and admit that you are just small minded bigoted homophobes.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Originally posted by JimL View Post
                            The military caters to the medical needs of all military personel and the costs for viagra alone in the military far outwieghs the costs of transgender issues. Funny, never heard any of you complaining about that. Why don't you just tell the truth and admit that you are just small minded bigoted homophobes.
                            I have seen that meme being passed around. Got any actual numbers?

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              From his Twitter.

                              Source: Trump's Twitter Jul 26, 2017

                              After consultation with my Generals and military experts, please be advised that the United States Government will not accept or allow.....Transgender individuals to serve in any capacity in the U.S. Military. Our military must be focused on decisive and overwhelming....victory and cannot be burdened with the tremendous medical costs and disruption that transgender in the military would entail. Thank you.

                              © Copyright Original Source



                              He does point to disruption, but he puts it together with medical costs.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                                I have seen that meme being passed around. Got any actual numbers?
                                Yes Trump did cite costs, "tremendous medical costs." Another lie!

                                Comment

                                Related Threads

                                Collapse

                                Topics Statistics Last Post
                                Started by seer, Yesterday, 01:12 PM
                                4 responses
                                72 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Sparko
                                by Sparko
                                 
                                Started by rogue06, 04-17-2024, 09:33 AM
                                45 responses
                                406 views
                                1 like
                                Last Post Starlight  
                                Started by whag, 04-16-2024, 10:43 PM
                                60 responses
                                390 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post seanD
                                by seanD
                                 
                                Started by rogue06, 04-16-2024, 09:38 AM
                                0 responses
                                27 views
                                1 like
                                Last Post rogue06
                                by rogue06
                                 
                                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 04-16-2024, 06:47 AM
                                100 responses
                                451 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Hypatia_Alexandria  
                                Working...
                                X