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Response to Veretuesi post on Genesis and Fundamentalist Creationism

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  • #61
    Originally posted by psstein View Post
    <snip>

    2. Elements of the narrative strongly point towards a 13th century date, rather than an earlier one.
    What elements of the narrative? And please, why?
    . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by 37818 View Post
      Well yes. But because the text Acts 13:18-22 (v.22 reference 1 Kings 2:11) calculates 570 years over against 480 of 1 Kings 6:1. There being evidence that number could be wrong given that the LXX has 440 years. And in this case it is worse. A 90 to 130 year discrepancy. Acts account was more recently written and less likely to have a textual problem. And Hebrew texts being older is notorious for having some textual issues with numbers.
      Textual issues are concerned with how closely the extant documents match the original documents. They tell us nothing about whether we should believe what was in the original documents.

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by Doug Shaver View Post
        Textual issues are concerned with how closely the extant documents match the original documents. They tell us nothing about whether we should believe what was in the original documents.
        The original documents do not exist.
        Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
        Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
        But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

        go with the flow the river knows . . .

        Frank

        I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
          The original documents do not exist.
          Yes, I'm aware of that. Did you think I wasn't?

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by Doug Shaver View Post
            Yes, I'm aware of that. Did you think I wasn't?
            I was being blunt to those who propose that it was the original texts that are accurate or infallible, which is a paradox, because no 'original texts' are known to exist for any book in the Bible.
            Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
            Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
            But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

            go with the flow the river knows . . .

            Frank

            I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by 37818 View Post
              What elements of the narrative? And please, why?
              The description of slavery strongly corresponds to a 13th century date. The knowledge of geography makes sense in that context as well. The "way of the Philistines," while anachronistically named in the text, was a heavily fortified area.

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                I was being blunt to those who propose that it was the original texts that are accurate or infallible, which is a paradox, because no 'original texts' are known to exist for any book in the Bible.
                The dogma of scriptural inerrancy would not be any more defensible if we did have the original texts. There is no noncircular argument for it, and no other objection is needed.

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                  I was being blunt to those who propose that it was the original texts that are accurate or infallible, which is a paradox, because no 'original texts' are known to exist for any book in the Bible.
                  This does not logically follow. The present availability (or not) of any original documents has no bearing on their accuracy or fallibility, assuming that they once existed.

                  Or do you deny that original documents (of Paul's letters, of example) EVER existed?
                  "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." – Albert Einstein

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Kbertsche View Post

                    Or do you deny that original documents (of Paul's letters, of example) EVER existed?
                    Some yes, but not all were likely Paul's, and there was likely editing.
                    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                    go with the flow the river knows . . .

                    Frank

                    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                    Comment

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