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Thread: Your Views on Patriarchy

  1. #51
    tWebber Darth Executor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    No. We start with Scripture, which shows that God created humans male and female, equally bearing the image of God, and assigned both of them to rule the earth and all other living creatures on it. (Gen. 1:26-28) There is no mention of one of the humans ruling over the other.
    1. It's not very detailed.
    2. It does not even say they equally bear the image of God.
    3. It is obvious from the context that eve was created for Adam's benefit because God made Adam first, then stated it is not good for him to be alone. Exactly what degree of subordination this entails isn't stated just from Genesis, but it does set a pattern of man having his own goals and women being there to support said goals.

    Let's not forget that they originally looked for a helper among animals, but none was found.

    Neither was created to "order around" the other. The woman was created as a "suitable companion" for him. The NET translation helpfully notes that the Hebrew word "ezer," often translated helper, does *not* convey the sense of subordination.
    The word is used earlier when it states there was no help found for him among the animals. Do you think it does not convey any sense of subordination there as well? How can someone even be considered help if he is not subordinate to the person he is helping?

    I don't know where you got that quote. You pulled it out of some orifice with no citation of source. And I don't know how you came up with that dim-witted interpretation of it. In the egalitarian model, male and female are equal. Neither is automatically prohibited any "role" solely on the basis of gender. We serve God as equal partners. We also sometimes refer to ourselves as "mutualists," because submission is not one-sided. We are always ready to defer to each other. So, yes, in a given situation, either can be the "leader," depending on knowledge, gifting, etc., or they can collaborate with neither really being "the" leader.
    My apologies, I often think and write too fast assuming the person on the other end can keep up. I will try to slow down, so that someone of your vastly inferior intellect isn't completely lost.

    For starters, I don't understand why you are talking about being prohibited any role when I say you believe you are not prescribed any roles. They are completely different things.

    The rest of your post is also, amusingly enough, unwittingly making the case I made.

    You are clearly speaking from poorly informed preconceptions, utterly ignorant of actual egalitarian Scriptural arguments and life practices.
    Quite the opposite, I see egalitarianism fail over and over again. The only egalitarians who do not fail are the ones who unwittingly follow complementarian prescriptions but falsely believe themselves to be egalitarian (IE: men/women who closely follow gender roles but think they are actually a mixture of both)

    The unnamed poster did not use the word, "authority." (As a possibly interesting digression, the word "authority" does not occur in any of the NT passages commonly invoked when discussing family structure, with the exception of 1 Cor. 11, where the woman is the one who has "authority" in the matter there under discussion.) The poster used the word "superiority." If one has the tie-breaking vote, how is that one not in position of superiority? If one gender always has the tie-breaking vote, how is that gender not in a position of superiority?
    If you view getting your way as an unmitigated good, as egalitarians do, you are correct. Of course, I am not an egalitarian so I think the answer to your question from my perspective is self evident, if only you were capable of thinking about it from a different perspective.
    "Should you help the wicked and love those who hate the Lord? Because of this, the wrath of the Lord is on you." ~ 2 Chronicles 19:2

    "The righteous will be glad when they are avenged, when they dip their feet in the blood of the wicked." ~ Psalm 58:10

  2. #52
    tWebber Darth Executor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    You are not making sense. You claim that we egalitarians are the ones who equate authority with superiority, and then go on to explicitly say that some really are "better." Explain yourself more clearly.
    I put it in quotation marks for the obvious reason that I was quoting the egalitarian perspective.
    "Should you help the wicked and love those who hate the Lord? Because of this, the wrath of the Lord is on you." ~ 2 Chronicles 19:2

    "The righteous will be glad when they are avenged, when they dip their feet in the blood of the wicked." ~ Psalm 58:10

  3. #53
    tWebber Darth Executor's Avatar
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    wildflower logic: Giving money to the homeless can be abused. So don't give anything to the homeless.
    "Should you help the wicked and love those who hate the Lord? Because of this, the wrath of the Lord is on you." ~ 2 Chronicles 19:2

    "The righteous will be glad when they are avenged, when they dip their feet in the blood of the wicked." ~ Psalm 58:10

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