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Future ministry opportunities for disgraced televangelists?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
    Agreed
    This part is where I disagree. Some mistakes should require greater scrutiny to recover from, I grant - but if denying Jesus and running out on Him at the time of trial wasn't a disqualifier, I don't see where anything should be.
    As I already said, I think there's a massive difference in screwing up because you were scared of dying and screwing up because you were pursuing your own selfish desires. I expect most of us would break under the right circumstances. And those circumstances should matter when making people leaders.
    "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

    There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
      Peter, you mean? Peter wasn't even a Christian when that happened because Christianity didn't yet exist.
      And he was not caught up in any sex scandal.
      Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
        I grant that when we are discussing questionable ministries, that becomes the issue - it might even be the real issue here. But that's not what KG asked - he effectively asked should we ever truly forgive theses guys? The answer is yes, we should, and IF they continue in true ministry, there's no issue with it. The church is greater for its forgiveness than for making sure its public image is squeaky clean.
        We should forgive them if they repent, but not trust them with the same sort of ministry they had before.

        Now, the real problem is discerning legitimate from illegitimate ministries.
        I do not think it is all that difficult to discern illegitimate ministries if the "ministry" serves mostly to enrich the "minister."
        Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

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        • #19
          Strictly speaking, I don't think a major moral fall like a sex scandal can permanently disqualify a disgraced minister (televangelist or otherwise) from ministry. But part of repentance in such a case is recognizing the harm done to the public reputation of Christ and his Church by such scandals. And repentance then ought to entail taking care that one's future ministry will not further perpetuate harm to said name. So repentance and restoration, particularly in high-profile cases, probably ought to involve a lengthy process for re-training in virtue and discipline, and also should lead to a less public ministry setting. For that reason, a disgraced televangelist, celebrity preacher, etc., moving suddenly back into high-profile ministry is a cause for concern, and suggests that perhaps the minister has not sufficiently glimpsed the serious ramifications for the church of his scandals.
          "The Jesus Christ who saves sinners is the same Christ who beckons his followers to serious use of their minds for serious explorations of the world." - Mark Noll

          "It cannot be that the people should grow in grace unless they give themselves to reading." - John Wesley

          "Wherever men are still theological, there is still some chance of their being logical." - G. K. Chesterton

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
            You mean like Paul who denied the Lord three times?
            Peter.

            I'm always still in trouble again

            "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
            "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
            "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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            • #21
              Years ago we had a man guilty of stealing money from a local ministry. I would never put such a person in a position where he had access to money. Sexual scandals are not a lot different.
              Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

              Comment


              • #22
                If I am remembering correctly, Jim Bakker really repented and turned his life around after the PTL scandal. I think he is still a bit out there on the end times prophesy thing but from what I have seen (been a few years now) he really repented, admitted his crimes, served his time, and has not used his ministry as a scam since and is no longer a prosperity teacher. He said, "The more I studied the Bible, however, I had to admit that the prosperity message did not line up with the tenor of Scripture. My heart was crushed to think that I led so many people astray. I was appalled that I could have been so wrong, and I was deeply grateful that God had not struck me dead as a false prophet!"

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by JB DoulosChristou View Post
                  Strictly speaking, I don't think a major moral fall like a sex scandal can permanently disqualify a disgraced minister (televangelist or otherwise) from ministry. But part of repentance in such a case is recognizing the harm done to the public reputation of Christ and his Church by such scandals. And repentance then ought to entail taking care that one's future ministry will not further perpetuate harm to said name. So repentance and restoration, particularly in high-profile cases, probably ought to involve a lengthy process for re-training in virtue and discipline, and also should lead to a less public ministry setting. For that reason, a disgraced televangelist, celebrity preacher, etc., moving suddenly back into high-profile ministry is a cause for concern, and suggests that perhaps the minister has not sufficiently glimpsed the serious ramifications for the church of his scandals.
                  While a major moral fall can certainly be repented of and forgiven, IMO someone who has so badly failed the trust once placed in them should not return to a position of leadership.
                  Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                  Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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                  I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                    While a major moral fall can certainly be repented of and forgiven, IMO someone who has so badly failed the trust once placed in them should not return to a position of leadership.
                    And then there are those who got caught, publicly asked for forgiveness only to turn around and do it again. Jimmy Swaggart comes to mind.

                    I'm always still in trouble again

                    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                    "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                      Peter.
                      Yeah, yeah, we got that.
                      "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

                      "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

                      My Personal Blog

                      My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
                        I do not think it is all that difficult to discern illegitimate ministries if the "ministry" serves mostly to enrich the "minister."
                        I agree. It might take a little effort to discern.

                        I get a little more concerned with the "Christian in name only." I mean ministers who deny God existence, believe Jesus was only a man and yet still call themselves a Christian. They're entitled to whatever they want to believe, but what about the poor souls they will take to Hell with them through their false teaching?
                        "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

                        "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
                          Yeah, yeah, we got that.
                          Peter.


                          Just making sure.

                          I'm always still in trouble again

                          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                          "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Hey Teal, did you mean Peter?



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                            • #29
                              By George, I believe she meant Peter

                              I'm always still in trouble again

                              "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                              "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                              "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                                By George, I believe she meant Peter
                                Peter who?

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