Hugh Hefner is now in hell

[37818]

Yes, one can just see Trump repenting. He's never wrong...didn't you know?

But there's no substantive reason to to believe in any form of life beyond death. To the best of our knowledge all living creatures perish, no amount of wish fulfilment can change that.



There is no good reason to think so.

Yes, in your view, there not being any God.

[37818]

Yes, I understand, you live your life in fear of god and death.

Not at all. (1 John 3:19-21; 1 John 4:18).

. . . I don't. You could also think of it this way, if there is a god, how likely is it to be the evil god such as the biblical one who would do such evil things to his living creatures such as burning them in hell and all that nonsense. Just be a good person, get rid of your guilt and fear, and enjoy your life, if a good god exists he won't punish you for that.

God is infinite good. But all men are sinners (Romans 3:23-26). God provided a way (Titus 1:2). But if you reject it (1 John 5:9-12) you are calling God a liar.

There being no good reason to believe in the first place, is itself reason to believe I'm right.

So you think (Proverbs 14:12).

[JimL]

You didn't refute anything Jim, you just repeated yourself.

Normally I would say, I don't care what you do, if you want to ignore the truth and end up in hell, go ahead. But I actually do care. I don't want anyone to end up in hell. So I am trying to explain it to you in simple terms. God gives us a way out of our own deserved punishment. He doesn't owe us a way out but he cares and wants to save you. He is throwing you a rope after you have jumped into the water and are drowning. If you don't take the rope, you can't blame God. If you don't even know about the rope you can't blame God. You are the one who jumped in. You committed the sins. When you stand before God and he judges you, it will be on your own actions. God didn't make you sin. You did that all on your own.

Again, its a ridiculous argument, or as I said, ridiculous refutation of what I pointed out. According to your belief we are all sinners Sparko, whether you are knowledgeable and believe in your god or not. So it would be unjust of a god to offer to save those who know and believe, but not those who knew not and so did not believe, and so condemn them to eternal hell. Its just illogical and dumb.

Now I know you actually understand but you merely don't give a crap and just want to mock. So that is on your own head.

Wrong, its not your god that I don't believe in, its your assertion of the existence of that god that I don't believe in.

[Sparko]

Again, its a ridiculous argument, or as I said, ridiculous refutation of what I pointed out. According to your belief we are all sinners Sparko, whether you are knowledgeable and believe in your god or not. So it would be unjust of a god to offer to save those who know and believe, but not those who knew not and so did not believe, and so condemn them to eternal hell. Its just illogical and dumb.

Nobody ever said that salvation was just. Quite the opposite. It is unjust. We don't deserve to be saved any more than the prisoner deserves to be let out of prison. It is only because of God's mercy that we are.

Wrong, its not your god that I don't believe in, its your assertion of the existence of that god that I don't believe in.

The end result is that you are going to hell for your own actions and rejecting a way to avoid that. Or you could be right and there is no God and we all just cease to exist, which means I am wasting my time believing in something that doesn't exist. But it's my life and I find that I am a better person because of my faith than I was without it.

[JimL]

Nobody ever said that salvation was just. Quite the opposite. It is unjust. We don't deserve to be saved any more than the prisoner deserves to be let out of prison. It is only because of God's mercy that we are.

Okay, so your god is unjust in his treatment of his creatures, right? You just happen to be one of the fortunate, or chosen ones, right?

The end result is that you are going to hell for your own actions and rejecting a way to avoid that. Or you could be right and there is no God and we all just cease to exist, which means I am wasting my time believing in something that doesn't exist. But it's my life and I find that I am a better person because of my faith than I was without it.

I agree, you probably are a better person because of your belief, and that is good for society, thats why we created gods.

[Sparko]

Okay, so your god is unjust in his treatment of his creatures, right? You just happen to be one of the fortunate, or chosen ones, right?

Don't worry JimL. You will be treated justly.

I agree, you probably are a better person because of your belief, and that is good for society, thats why we created gods.

Maybe you should try it.

[Darth Executor]

Well thats a nonsensical response. So god punishes, sends to hell for all eternity, all those billions who have never heard of him. Thats what you call a just god? You simply, and poorly, defend the indefensible, because you feel that you have to in order to maintain your belief.

It's not a nonsensical response, God is not our equal and has explicitly said He can do whatever He wants with His domain. That He allows an escape clause at all is within the bounds of both justice and mercy.

[Darth Executor]

And you think that helps your argument?

I haven't even presented my argument, but it does knock the wind out of the sails of yours because it's not true that most people haven't heard of Jesus.

[Darth Executor]

That is not an "irrelevant difference". I wouldn't bother nitpicking, as I'm fully aware that no analogy is going to be perfect.

That we all commit crimes is an irrelevant difference. It has nothing to do with my argument one way or the other. That people go to hell because they reject God is not even outside the bounds of my analogy, which doesn't specify a crime (because it's also irrelevant).

[JimL]

Don't worry JimL. You will be treated justly.

Perhaps you just don't want to answer to my point. Its not about me, its about the billions over time that never knew anything about your god, so didn't believe in your god. According to you its, oh well to bad for them, off to eternal hell they go. I mean if thats the kind of thing that you can believe in, then all I can say is you're a very naive person who is willing to believe anything so long as it promises him a future reward.

Maybe you should try it.

Been there, done that, its a lie, you're going to die.

[Darth Executor]

Perhaps you just don't want to answer to my point. Its not about me, its about the billions over time that never knew anything about your god, so didn't believe in your god. According to you its, oh well to bad for them, off to eternal hell they go. I mean if thats the kind of thing that you can believe in, then all I can say is you're a very naive person who is willing to believe anything so long as it promises him a future reward.

I'm not sure why you think the credibility of the Christian God's existence rests on whether it offends your sense of morality or not.

[JimL]

I'm not sure why you think the credibility of the Christian God's existence rests on whether it offends your sense of morality or not.

You're belief is merely self serving, thats why.

[Darth Executor]

You're belief is merely self serving, thats why.

wouldn't believing there's an alternate track for people who never heard of Jesus be even more self serving? It's not like you can get converts to a religion if they don't even know it exists so there's no opportunity cost like with full universalism.

[Sparko]

Perhaps you just don't want to answer to my point.

I did answer your point. many times now. You just ignore my answer, call it stupid and repeat yourself.

Its not about me, its about the billions over time that never knew anything about your god, so didn't believe in your god. According to you its, oh well to bad for them, off to eternal hell they go. I mean if thats the kind of thing that you can believe in, then all I can say is you're a very naive person who is willing to believe anything so long as it promises him a future reward.

It is about you Jim. You are the one who can't seem to grasp the facts here.

Want to try it slowly?

1. If one person breaks the law by committing a felony the just thing is for them to be judged and put in prison. correct?

2. If a billion people break the law by committing a felony the just thing is for them to be judged and put in prison, correct?

[37818]

Been there, done that, its a lie, you're going to die.

Been where, done what? What was the lie you discovered? And yes we are going to die (Hebrews 9:27).