Harvey Weinstein: Another Good Liberal...

[Cow Poke]

This is a gross oversimplification of what occurred as has been explained umpteen times.

No, it's not. And you can say 'umpteen times' that a rock is a puppy, but it's not going to bark or pee.

The only possible motivation is your dishonest

Unless you can prove I'm being dishonest, you need to shut your yap. You're calling me a liar without substantiating the allegation, which is a violation of this board's policies.

and inaccurate attempt to conflate gays and lesbians with pedophilia so as to further your evangelical agenda.

I don't HAVE to 'conflate gays and lesbians with pedophilia' - the THREE pedophile groups were PART of ILGA for a DECADE, and no goofy attempt by you to try to say they "infiltrated" is going to work.

The bottom line is that “NAMBLA was expelled from ILGA

Only AFTER being outed by Jesse Helms. That's a fact.

in ‘94 and a series of amendments were voted by ILGA members to ensure groups condoning pedophilia

Again, AFTER being associated with these three pedophilia groups for a DECADE.

would not be able to become members of the federation.

And ILGA could not get the recognition they wanted until they got rid of the pedophile groups.

ILGA has not had any such group, nor any association with such groups, since then.

That does not change their history. As Rogue has stated...

Maybe, just maybe now, perhaps they might actually finally disown the position in the Gay Rights Platform at the 1972 National Coalition of Gay Organizations Convention which calls for "Repeal of all laws governing the age of sexual consent" (#7 of actions to be taken at the state level).

Somehow I figure that you will find away to excuse their not doing so at some point over the past 45 years.

All you have is spin and false accusations of dishonesty on my part. The facts are NOT on your side.

[Tassman]

No, it's not. And you can say 'umpteen times' that a rock is a puppy, but it's not going to bark or pee.

Charming analogy!

Your narrative that ILGA willingly accepted three pedophile organisations under its umbrella and only reluctantly expelled them, which is your ongoing insinuation, is simplistic to the point of dishonesty...as has been pointed out umpteen times in this thread.

Unless you can prove I'm being dishonest, you need to shut your yap. You're calling me a liar without substantiating the allegation, which is a violation of this board's policies.

See above.

I don't HAVE to 'conflate gays and lesbians with pedophilia' - the THREE pedophile groups were PART of ILGA for a DECADE, and no goofy attempt by you to try to say they "infiltrated" is going to work.

That’s what I mean by “dishonest”. I have several times linked and quoted “Hans Hjerpekjon, secretary-general of the Brussels-based ILGA, who said NAMBLA joined the association about 15 years ago [this is dated 1994], when it was a loose network with no rules for admission”. In short, NAMBLA infiltrated ILGA before it had sufficient vetting procedures in place.

But this doesn’t suit your narrative that homosexuals and pedophiles are two sides of the same coin, does it? This is where you’re being dishonest. Your evangelical narrative needs to have NAMBLA and ILGA skipping hand-in-hand along the flower strewn path happy and united...until naughty Jesse Helms pulled the plug and made ILGA reluctantly expel NAMBLA. This is your narrative and it is deliberately misleading.

Only AFTER being outed by Jesse Helms. That's a fact.

Only as far as it goes! This is the point. Hans Hjerpekjon, secretary-general of ILGA said ILGA has been concerned about its association with NAMBLA since the late 1980s and has urged the group to resign. In 1990, at the behest of member organizations from Scandinavia, Australia and New Zealand, ILGA adopted a resolution denouncing pedophilia, he said. So your argument that ILGA wanted NAMBLA within its organisation is not supported by facts...despite your homophobic attempts to closely link ILGA and NAMBLA.

Again, AFTER being associated with these three pedophilia groups for a DECADE.

See above.

[ke7ejx]

Tassman, you really need to just shut up. You're not backing anything up in your accusations and it's making you look like an asinine jerk.

[Cow Poke]

Charming analogy!

Because it works.

Your narrative that ILGA willingly accepted three pedophile organisations under its umbrella

A conclusion based on FACTS, absent spin.

and only reluctantly expelled them

That's what the record shows.

which is your ongoing insinuation,

It's not an insinuation at all - conclusion based on the facts.

is simplistic to the point of dishonesty...

What is dishonest? Which facts do I have wrong? The FACT that I provide a lot more of the actual record than you shows that YOU are the one guilty of oversimplification with your "end of story" garbage.

as has been pointed out umpteen times in this thread.

Tassy, honey, just spewing forth the same ignorance over and over does not make it true, or you right. Get that nonsense out of your head.

That’s what I mean by “dishonest”.

There is nothing dishonest about it. I provide the facts, and offer my honest conclusion. That you disagree does not in any way prove dishonesty on my part.

I have several times

So? You spew forth idiot assertions like "NAMBLA infiltrated" ILGA 'several times', and all it does is make you look more stupid.

linked and quoted “Hans Hjerpekjon, secretary-general of the Brussels-based ILGA, who said NAMBLA joined the association about 15 years ago [this is dated 1994], when it was a loose network with no rules for admission”.

NAMBLA helped ILGA write their constitution. NAMBLA became poison to ILGA. What do you EXPECT they would say? They're trying their best to distance themselves from a group that was WITH them pretty much from DAY 1.

In short, NAMBLA infiltrated ILGA before it had sufficient vetting procedures in place.

Now THAT, my friend, is an "oversimplification". You might want to look that word up in the dictionary, because YOU are the one who keeps trying to do that. No, there is ZERO basis for this goofy nutty claim that NAMBLA "infiltrated".

All that does is indicate that you think that gays and lesbians are really really stupid people. Maybe you believe JimL that they were even too stupid to know what a "boy" was.

But this doesn’t suit your narrative that homosexuals and pedophiles are two sides of the same coin, does it?

Now, THERE is classic dishonesty. I have never made such a claim.

This is where you’re being dishonest.

Any dishonesty on my part in this discussion is in your big empty prejudiced head.

Your evangelical narrative

You mean, your goofy ASSUMPTION of my 'evangelical narrative'. I provide facts and historical record, you produce GOOFY theories and false accusations.

Sheeeesh, Tassy - you're a piece of work!

needs to have NAMBLA and ILGA skipping hand-in-hand along the flower strewn path h1appy and united...

You're coming off the rails, my friend.

until naughty Jesse Helms

"naughty Jesse Helms"?

pulled the plug and made ILGA reluctantly expel NAMBLA.

Wow, that's quite a bit of drama queen theme interpretation ya got going on there, Tassy. Is there a little dance that goes with that?

This is your narrative and it is deliberately misleading.

Nope, I lay out the facts, most of which come from ILGA's own website. You simply can't handle the truth.

[Tassman]

A conclusion based on FACTS, absent spin.

No. The “facts” are that “Hans Hjerpekjon, secretary-general of ILGA, said NAMBLA joined the association when it was a loose network with no rules for admission”. In short, NAMBLA infiltrated ILGA before it had sufficient vetting procedures in place.

The “spin” is yours.

That's what the record shows.

No. Hans Hjerpekjon, secretary-general of ILGA said ILGA had been concerned about its association with NAMBLA since the late 1980s and urged the group to resign. In 1990, at the behest of member organizations from Scandinavia, Australia and New Zealand, ILGA adopted a resolution denouncing pedophilia, he said. This all predated Jesse Helm’s involvement.

They’re the facts; the rest is your spin.

It's not an insinuation at all - conclusion based on the facts.

It’s a homophobic insinuation based upon spin.

What is dishonest? Which facts do I have wrong? The FACT that I provide a lot more of the actual record than you shows that YOU are the one guilty of oversimplification with your "end of story" garbage.

What is dishonest is your selective use of facts to insinuate that NAMBLA and ILGA shared a common goal when the reverse is true. Their goals were quite different.

There is nothing dishonest about it. I provide the facts, and offer my honest conclusion. That you disagree does not in any way prove dishonesty on my part.

Your “honest conclusion” is that NAMBLA and ILGA are two sides of the same coin, i.e. both equally “bad”. This is the whole point of your exercise. Admit it. What other motive could you possibly have?

So? You spew forth idiot assertions like "NAMBLA infiltrated" ILGA 'several times', and all it does is make you look more stupid.

I quoted the secretary-general of ILGA, who said NAMBLA joined the association when it was a loose network with no rules for admission”. In short, NAMBLA infiltrated ILGA before ILGA had sufficient vetting procedures in place. NAMBLA would not have gotten in under the stringent rules put in place following NAMBLA’s expulsion from ILGA several decades ago.

NAMBLA helped ILGA write their constitution. NAMBLA became poison to ILGA. What do you EXPECT they would say? They're trying their best to distance themselves from a group that was WITH them pretty much from DAY 1.

NAMBLA was one of over 400 hundred members of ILGA. The claim that it helped draft ILGA’s constitution was made by NAMBLA itself in a futile effort to restore its credibility and membership.

All that does is indicate that you think that gays and lesbians are really really stupid people. Maybe you believe JimL that they were even too stupid to know what a "boy" was.

All that it indicates is that ILGA was badly organised during its formative stages. The same is not true now and there is no place for pedophilia in ILGA and nor has there been for several decades.

Now, THERE is classic dishonesty. I have never made such a claim.

REALLY! Then why are you making such a big deal of the initial association between NAMBLA and ILGA...an association that has not existed for the past 23 years? What are you trying to tell us...that ILGA likes pedophiles? But it doesn’t. In 1993 the executive committee declared that ILGA "condemns pedophilia" and asked NAMBLA, Martijn, and Project Truth to resign voluntarily from ILGA. They refused and ultimately had to be forced out.

You mean, your goofy ASSUMPTION of my 'evangelical narrative'. I provide facts and historical record, you produce GOOFY theories and false accusations.

The question is WHY you “provide facts and historical record” of the one-time association between NAMBLA and ILGA. Why? What's in it for you? What is your purpose? This you’ve never answered. Is it the evangelical urge to tar LGBT’s with the same brush as pedophiles? Is this it? I can think of no other reason.

Nope, I lay out the facts, most of which come from ILGA's own website. You simply can't handle the truth.

So what is this terrible “truth” you’re flogging about NAMBLA and ILGA? Waiting.

[MaxVel]

Because it works.



A conclusion based on FACTS, absent spin.



That's what the record shows.



It's not an insinuation at all - conclusion based on the facts.



What is dishonest? Which facts do I have wrong? The FACT that I provide a lot more of the actual record than you shows that YOU are the one guilty of oversimplification with your "end of story" garbage.



Tassy, honey, just spewing forth the same ignorance over and over does not make it true, or you right. Get that nonsense out of your head.



There is nothing dishonest about it. I provide the facts, and offer my honest conclusion. That you disagree does not in any way prove dishonesty on my part.



So? You spew forth idiot assertions like "NAMBLA infiltrated" ILGA 'several times', and all it does is make you look more stupid.



NAMBLA helped ILGA write their constitution. NAMBLA became poison to ILGA. What do you EXPECT they would say? They're trying their best to distance themselves from a group that was WITH them pretty much from DAY 1.





Now THAT, my friend, is an "oversimplification". You might want to look that word up in the dictionary, because YOU are the one who keeps trying to do that. No, there is ZERO basis for this goofy nutty claim that NAMBLA "infiltrated".

All that does is indicate that you think that gays and lesbians are really really stupid people. Maybe you believe JimL that they were even too stupid to know what a "boy" was.



Now, THERE is classic dishonesty. I have never made such a claim.



Any dishonesty on my part in this discussion is in your big empty prejudiced head.



You mean, your goofy ASSUMPTION of my 'evangelical narrative'. I provide facts and historical record, you produce GOOFY theories and false accusations.

Sheeeesh, Tassy - you're a piece of work!



You're coming off the rails, my friend.



"naughty Jesse Helms"?



Wow, that's quite a bit of drama queen theme interpretation ya got going on there, Tassy. Is there a little dance that goes with that?



Nope, I lay out the facts, most of which come from ILGA's own website. You simply can't handle the truth.

Don't forget that Tassman blithely plagiarises all sorts of things in his posts, and when confronted, simply responds 'I didn't plagiarise from there, I got it from here' as if that made it all OK. And somehow you're the 'dishonest' one.

[Cow Poke]

No. The “facts”...

...totally irrelevant to you, unless they support your agenda.

But do continue your

• "gays and lesbians are SO STUPID that they couldn't recognize NAMBLA for what it was, even though 'Boy Love' was in their title" defense, along with
• JimL's defense that "gays and lesbians are SO STUPID that they didn't know what a 'Boy' was" and
• "gays and lesbians are SO STUPID that they couldn't even set up a coalition without including pedophile organizations"....

You're doing great Tassy. You're quite the ILGA apologist! Keep it up! The gays and lesbians - particularly the lesbian who was my executive admin for 10 years - are much smarter than you portray.

[rogue06]

Don't forget that Tassman blithely plagiarises all sorts of things in his posts, and when confronted, simply responds 'I didn't plagiarise from there, I got it from here' as if that made it all OK. And somehow you're the 'dishonest' one.

Reminds me of a clown on another forum who would blatantly plagiarize something then insist since he wrote it out himself that means he didn't plagiarize it

[rogue06]

...totally irrelevant to you, unless they support your agenda.

But do continue your

• "gays and lesbians are SO STUPID that they couldn't recognize NAMBLA for what it was, even though 'Boy Love' was in their title" defense, along with
• JimL's defense that "gays and lesbians are SO STUPID that they didn't know what a 'Boy' was" and
• "gays and lesbians are SO STUPID that they couldn't even set up a coalition without including pedophile organizations"....

You're doing great Tassy. You're quite the ILGA apologist! Keep it up! The gays and lesbians - particularly the lesbian who was my executive admin for 10 years - are much smarter than you portray.

He wants us to believe that while NAMBLA has never hid what they are and what they want and were very active in IGLA yet for 10 full years nobody else in IGLA noticed.

tenor.gif

[Tassman]

...totally irrelevant to you, unless they support your agenda.

It’s YOUR agenda that you have yet to explain. The question is WHY you “provide facts and historical record” of the one-time association between NAMBLA and ILGA. Why? What's in it for you? What is your purpose? This you’ve never answered. Is it the evangelical urge to tar LGBT’s with the same brush as pedophiles? Is this it? I can think of no other reason.

You're doing great Tassy. You're quite the ILGA apologist! Keep it up! The gays and lesbians - particularly the lesbian who was my executive admin for 10 years - are much smarter than you portray.

Oh you know a lesbian? Well done. Some of my best friends are blacks too.

It reminds me of the tone-deaf Mrs Roy Moore: “Our Attorney is a JEW!!! Didn’t help her pedophile husband get into power though!

[Cow Poke]

It’s YOUR agenda that you have yet to explain. The question is WHY you “provide facts and historical record” of the one-time association between NAMBLA and ILGA. Why? What's in it for you? What is your purpose? This you’ve never answered. Is it the evangelical urge to tar LGBT’s with the same brush as pedophiles? Is this it? I can think of no other reason.

I don't have to explain a cotton pickin thing, darlin. All I have to do is accurately post the history, and not just pick out the details I want to highlight, gloss over the facts, then declare "end of story", like you do.

Oh you know a lesbian? Well done.

I don't just 'know her', she is a good friend, and was my executive admin for ten years. She was (and is) a pretty sharp woman - unlike how you suggest gays and lesbians are so STUPID that they couldn't figure out what NAMBLA was, and so INCOMPETENT that they didn't know how to start up an organization.

[Tassman]

I don't have to explain a cotton pickin thing, darlin. All I have to do is accurately post the history, and not just pick out the details I want to highlight, gloss over the facts, then declare "end of story", like you do.

That’s exactly what you have done with your homophobic innuendos and attempts to tar LGBT’s with the same brush as pedophiles.

[Cow Poke]

That’s exactly what you have done with your homophobic

False accusation noted - you have no class.

innuendos and attempts to tar LGBT’s with the same brush as pedophiles.

No, Tassy, it's your imagination and your hateful anti-Christian agenda. But do continue your moronic "gays and lesbians are really stupid people" defense. It's interesting to watch.

[Tassman]

False accusation noted - you have no class.

Really! Then all you have to do is correct me, this you have not done. So again, WHY are you concerned to “provide facts and historical record” of the one-time association between NAMBLA and ILGA. What is your purpose in doing this if not the evangelical urge to tar LGBT’s with the same brush as pedophiles? Waiting!

No, Tassy, it's your imagination and your hateful anti-Christian agenda.

As opposed to your "hateful" homophobic agenda you mean?

But do continue your moronic "gays and lesbians are really stupid people" defense. It's interesting to watch.

Why do you think there should be a defense?

[Cow Poke]

Really! Then all you have to do is correct me,

I have, repeatedly. You're a terrible student. You come to class with such and extreme bias that you are, quite honestly, unteachable.

As opposed to your "hateful" homophobic agenda you mean?

This is a false allegation you have yet to prove. While proof of your anti-Christian bias is all over this board, you can't find a single instance of homophobic behavior on my part. You have to imagine and manufacture it.

I lay out the facts, primarily from ILGA's own website, and you come up with goofy theories that just don't stand up to scrutiny.

Again, you indict gays and lesbians as really stupid people:

• You seem to think they are so incompetent that they were incapable of building an organization with simple checks and balances.
• You imply that they're too stupid to know what NAMBLA stood for, and just totally took NAMBLA at their word with ZERO due diligence.
• You didn't correct JimL's idiotic "they might not have known was a 'boy' was" defense, so, until told otherwise, I'll assume you ascribe to that theory as well. Care to weigh in on that?
• You imply that they were too stupid to know that they had pedophile perverts in their ranks, even cooperating with them in forming their constitution. They only expelled the pedophile groups (plural) when it became politically expedient for them to do so. That's the record.

I have very clearly shown that I do NOT believe gays and lesbians are inclined to be less intelligent than the population in general. In fact, I cite a prime example in my own experience that shows not only that I worked very closely in a supervisory capacity with a lesbian, but that I attest she was quite capable, intelligent, resourceful and competent. She often introduced herself, with a bit of irony, as "I'm his work wife".

You can keep falsely accusing me all you want, but you don't have a shred of evidence that I am homophobic in any way. That just simply fits your track record of anti-Christian bias all over this board, and is a substitute for any real reason or logic in the current discussion.

But do continue the spin, it is entertaining.