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California secessionists...

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  • California secessionists...

    California secessionists think their path to independence is easier than Catalonia’s

    The world has been watching the play-by-play of Catalonia’s bid for independence from Spain, but one group is tuning in more closely than most: California secessionists.

    The California Freedom Coalition, the campaign that has taken the lead in the effort to break California off from the United States, sees similarities with Catalonia’s secessionist movement. But there’s an important caveat: they believe California has more legal tools at its disposal, creating an easier path to secession – if that’s what Californians decide they want.
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

  • #2
    I think a lot of us would be thrilled if California seceded from the US. It would be like excising a tumour from an otherwise healthy body.

    Of course they would be bankrupt within a week of seceding and begging for reinstatement, but that would be their problem.
    Last edited by Mountain Man; 10-13-2017, 05:44 AM.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
      I think a lot of us would be thrilled if California seceded from the US. It would be like excising a tumour from an otherwise healthy body.

      Of course they would be bankrupt within a week of seceding and begging for reinstatement, but that would be their problem.
      Earthquakes, fires and California breaking off from the USA and becoming an island will resolve the problem.
      Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
      Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
      But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

      go with the flow the river knows . . .

      Frank

      I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

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      • #4
        legally they can't. After the civil war, it was decided that there is no path to secession. They would need to get the US constitution changed first. But I for one would not try to stop them. Maybe they could elect Weinstein as president.

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        • #5
          The only state that has a clause in its laws about secession is Texas. But we knew they were oddballs anyway.
          A happy family is but an earlier heaven.
          George Bernard Shaw

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          • #6
            I resemble that remark!
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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            • #7
              The 'legal' basis for secession would have to be fought out in the courts. As it stands, they can't secede.

              I'm more curious as to how they propose to maintain a fiscal house without Fed assistance?
              "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

              "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

              My Personal Blog

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              • #8
                Maybe Cali and Quebec can get together.

                I would let Quebec leave without thought. And, like, Cali, they'd be back in a minute with their hand out for the billions in transfer payments that Alberta has to send them every year. Even when Alberta's economy is in the tank.



                Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
                  The 'legal' basis for secession would have to be fought out in the courts. As it stands, they can't secede.

                  I'm more curious as to how they propose to maintain a fiscal house without Fed assistance?

                  They claim they send more money to DC than they get back.

                  From the OP -- “There are definitely similarities in the fiscal situation – we both give more than we get back,” said Dave Marin, director of research and policy for the California Freedom Coalition.

                  Source: http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-...#storylink=cpy
                  The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                    They claim they send more money to DC than they get back.

                    From the OP -- “There are definitely similarities in the fiscal situation – we both give more than we get back,” said Dave Marin, director of research and policy for the California Freedom Coalition.

                    Source: http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-...#storylink=cpy
                    It's probably true that Californians pay more in federal taxes than the money they get from the federal government. Of course, by that definition, they're getting little things like postal service, social security, and protection from foreign invasion for "free."
                    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                      It's probably true that Californians pay more in federal taxes than the money they get from the federal government. Of course, by that definition, they're getting little things like postal service, social security, and protection from foreign invasion for "free."
                      ooh yeah I didn't think of social security. I bet they won't want to give that up.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
                        I'm more curious as to how they propose to maintain a fiscal house without Fed assistance?
                        Yeah that!
                        Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

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                        • #13
                          I think I read somewhere that Alaska was the state that most "gets more than it gives"; it's understandable that a state like Alaska would likely be an outlier for many statistical purposes.
                          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                            California secessionists think their path to independence is easier than Catalonia’s
                            Sounds more they will whine for freedom, then surrender!!
                            Remember that you are dust and to dust you shall return.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                              legally they can't. After the civil war, it was decided that there is no path to secession. They would need to get the US constitution changed first. But I for one would not try to stop them. Maybe they could elect Weinstein as president.
                              Well, Texas v. White, is I believe the only Supreme Court case to actually touch on the subject of secession. To set the stage quickly, essentially the question was this: During the Civil War, United States bonds that Texas had were sold to some citizens to get money. After the Civil War, Texas's government decided it wanted the bonds back, and claimed that the selling of the bonds was illegal.

                              This went to the Supreme Court, which ruled 5-3 that because Texas had never legally left the country or ceased being a state, any actions taken by the confederate government (outside of routine matters) were illegal, and thus the selling of the bonds was invalid and Texas got to keep them. One can read the rationale for themselves here. This critical phrase was stated in the decision:
                              "The union between Texas and the other States was as complete, as perpetual, and as indissoluble as the union between the original States. There was no place for reconsideration or revocation, except through revolution or through consent of the States."

                              So two possibilities were given for a legal secession: "Revolution or consent of the States." Obviously, as the Civil War itself was a revolution, the former refers to successful revolution, as much as was the case in the Revolutionary War, your secession becomes ex post facto legal if you win any ensuing war. The latter is a bit more ambiguous (what qualifies as "consent of the States"?) but still indicates that if you can get enough of the rest of the country to go along with it, it's legal.

                              Mind you, this decision is from 1869 so who knows how binding it would be considered today. But it is the only time the Supreme Court officially touched on the subject, and that was their apparent opinion of what would make any secession legal.
                              Last edited by Terraceth; 10-13-2017, 08:49 PM.

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