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  • Another Post On Celebrating Halloween

    Should we?

    The link can be found here.

    -----

    Are Christians who celebrate Halloween disobeying Scripture? Let's plunge into the Deeper Waters and find out.

    Whenever the holidays come around, you can always find people who will speak about them being pagan. Christmas and Easter are common candidates. Next is Halloween. So it is that when we get to this time of year, a lot of people come out condemning Halloween and all Christians who celebrate it.*

    Consider this that was posted on a Ratio Christi page at Marshall. I was not able to find the original post myself, but I was told about it from someone who works with them. They claim it was from an atheist/buddhist, but it doesn't look like that to me. At any rate, the sentiment is common.

    -- FAKE CHRISTIANS celebrate hell-oween

    If you rejoice in the abomination of Hell-Oween today and you claim to be a "Christian". Your part of the problem of the world not coming to Christ. You don't set yourself apart, which is what being sanctified means. You rejoice in murder, witchcraft, darkness, death, skeletons, evil spirits ALL in the name of "all saints day", or its just for fun or "we are just having a good time". How wicked the American church is. It stinks as a worldly sent in the nostrils of almighty God. If I could I would declare today national repentence day for so many Christians holding hands with sinners, and when we are told by the bible to not even take council from the ungodly (psalm 1), much less live like them in their sinful celebrations. What saints are you "worshipping" today? You should be rejoicing in Holiness, righteousness, purity .. "Think on these things" (Phil 4:8).
    Today is a day to celebrate amnesty from the wicked Catholic Church (Reformation day) and all of its corru
    ption, not dressing up like Devils and watching perversion of evil movies and filth. Today is a openly professed hallowed day in strains of witchcraft and satanic churches and yet you are celebrating today with the lost? Wake up!!!!
    Or consider what a Christian said to me yesterday on a YouTube channel which shortly afterward the owner of said channel banned me from.

    Nick Peters My source is scripture. Come out from among them and be separate and I will receive you unto myself.--Source....God
    Touch not the unclean thing...
    Do not do as the other nations do. Do not take up their ways, neither give your sons or daughters to them in marriage.*
    If you spend time reading scripture rather than giving more weight to a "scholar" perhaps you wouldn't be verbally sparring with me. Is Jesus even your Lord or are you your own Lord??? Show me in Galations 5 what part of the fruit of the Holy Spirit are you writing to me. Is it love, joy peace, etc...do you even know what the fruit of the Spirit is. Where's your scholarly source...you have none.
    This was in reply to my asking for evidence from a scholarly source that Halloween is pagan. For too many Christians, God forbid you ask them a question. Do they have a point? Is this what we're supposed to do?

    Let's start with the second one. Are we supposed to come out and be separate? Yes. However, what does it mean to live like the people around you? I was out driving with my wife today. I suspect many people sharing the road with me driving were non-Christians. Am I being separate from them if I drive as well? I suspect many non-Christians see doctors, go out to eat, do grocery shopping, cook meals at home, etc. What is being talked about?

    In each case, it's talking about moral living. Now this would work as an argument against Halloween only if you apply the missing claim. Note that the very question under consideration is if the Bible tell us to not celebrate Halloween. Here is the way the argument goes.

    The Bible says to not live as the world lives.
    Celebrating Halloween is living as the world lives.
    Therefore, you should not celebrate Halloween.*

    Once again, the problem is that driving cars and going grocery shopping is also how the world lives. What else needs to be said? That moves us to touch not the unclean thing.

    The Bible says to touch not the unclean thing.*
    Halloween is the unclean thing.
    Therefore, you should not participate in Halloween.

    Again, it works, but only if you grant the second premise. Yet the second premise is the very thing under questions. It's just begging the question. Let's suppose I wanted to say something like dancing was wrong. Put in dancing in the second premise and the conclusion and the argument is the same. Unfortunately, it would only work if you accepted that dancing was wrong. None of these address the issue.

    The same comes with not doing as the world days or giving your sons and daughters to them in marriage. The last part shows we're dealing with a society of arranged marriages. The Israelites for day to day practices would have to interact with the pagans around them some. It was fine to do that provided they did not violate the covenant of YHWH.*

    What about the first statement shared to Ratio Christi? Well, this works on the same principle. If you accept the premises, the conclusion makes sense, but the premises are exactly what is under question. If someone is seriously not coming to Jesus because of Halloween, you have to wonder how much the search for truth is being taken seriously.

    Also, most people who are celebrating Halloween are not glorifying all the things spoken of. They're dressing in costumes, pretending, and getting candy. There are people who use holidays as an excuse to do any number of evil activities. That will not stop me from celebrating a holiday. When I was growing up, the big thing was a ninja. I just enjoyed being in the costume and pretending for a night. I'm quite sure I never even got around to eating all of my Halloween candy ever. Food just isn't a temptation for me.

    I am not going to say anything about the Reformation aside from, why not both? Plenty of Christians will be doing just that. They will celebrate the Reformation and give out candy to trick or treaters or take their kids out themselves.

    Note also that none of this is saying you have to celebrate Halloween. If you have some moral qualms, by all means don't celebrate. Feel free to share your opinion, but don't make it a point of Christian superiority. Let it be a Romans 14 matter.

    Also, keep in mind that even if Halloween was pagan in origin, that doesn't mean it is today. If a day was made to honor pagan gods and we spend that day dressing up in costumes and asking for candy instead, I think we've essentially shown the pagan god doesn't have influence. Redemption is not just about people. It is about the world as a whole.

    That includes Halloween.

    In Christ,
    Nick Peters

  • #2
    Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
    Should we?
    ....Also, most people who are celebrating Halloween are not glorifying all the things spoken of. They're dressing in costumes, pretending, and getting candy.
    At best, scripture is silent on dressing in costumes, pretending, and getting candy. Looking somewhat closer, dressing in costumes and pretending are both forms of deceit. You may argue that it's harmless, but it's not something I'm comfortable doing.
    Maybe I'm just reading too many ascetic texts lately.
    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
    sigpic
    I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

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    • #3
      Purim has people dressing up and getting sweets though.
      sigpic

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      • #4
        Originally posted by TheWall View Post
        Purim has people dressing up and getting sweets though.
        Dressing up as what? And why?
        Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
        sigpic
        I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

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        • #5
          Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
          Dressing up as what? And why?
          Dressing up as the characters from the book of Esther. It is a celebration of Esther thwarting Haman ( boo).
          sigpic

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          • #6
            Originally posted by TheWall View Post
            Dressing up as the characters from the book of Esther. It is a celebration of Esther thwarting Haman ( boo).
            Interesting. I wonder how old that tradition is?
            Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
            sigpic
            I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
              At best, scripture is silent on dressing in costumes, pretending, and getting candy. Looking somewhat closer, dressing in costumes and pretending are both forms of deceit. You may argue that it's harmless, but it's not something I'm comfortable doing.
              Maybe I'm just reading too many ascetic texts lately.
              I disagree. If you dressed up as a Disney princess and went door to door asking your neighbours for candy, they would think you were a weirdo, but I guarantee none of them would be fooled into thinking that you were either 1. a real Disney princess, or 2. actually trying to make them think you were a Disney princess. I've gone to geek conventions, where a lot of people are dressed as a favourite character. When I went in costume, no one thought I was really trying to make people think I was not just someone dressed up as someone else.

              On the same grounds as your objection, you could say that TV dramas or Broadway plays were wrong, since it's all pretend. I think you've been reading too many ascetic texts lately. There is a difference between deceit and make-believe.
              Curiosity never hurt anyone. It was stupidity that killed the cat.

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              • #8
                Not to mention what about fake-outs such as in sports or military campaigns. When the Israelites set out a decoy to rout out Ai, was that wrong?

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                • #9
                  Here's another article of interest. Apparently, it's not likely that Halloween even has pagan origins.

                  http://www.daimonologia.org/2014/10/...ns-of.html?m=1
                  Curiosity never hurt anyone. It was stupidity that killed the cat.

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                  • #10
                    I think this is one of the traditional arguments the church used against the theater (because it required dressing up in costumes), and that some have used against fiction in general. I have a hard time imagining this being a specific concern of Jesus or Paul.

                    I don't think either that or trick or treating is deceitful because it is not a serious attempt to convince anybody that one is actually what is in the costume. (I'm anti Halloween in general but this argument doesn't do it for me.)

                    OBP, out of curiosity, as a football fan, do you have a problem with offenses using trick plays and misdirections?
                    Last edited by KingsGambit; 11-01-2017, 09:09 PM.
                    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                      At best, scripture is silent on dressing in costumes, pretending, and getting candy. Looking somewhat closer, dressing in costumes and pretending are both forms of deceit. You may argue that it's harmless, but it's not something I'm comfortable doing.
                      Maybe I'm just reading too many ascetic texts lately.
                      Says the guy using a false name and photo on Tweb.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                        Says the guy using a false name and photo on Tweb.
                        ApplyColdWater.jpg

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                        • #13
                          I think there are two sides to the Halloween argument. One can be a very strong Christian and celebrate it as part of their Christian Heritige (All Saint's Eve, All Hallow's Eve attend mass etc.) or create a ministry out of it by handing out scripture in exchange for candy, have a lot of fun make your home a safe fun house in multiple ways ORRRRR There are those who practice occult rituals on Halloween, (last year we had no issue with it, the year before our home was the recipient of a spirit from an occult ritual that essentially did a "fly by" through our house and then left as quickly as it came. And this year we have a family on our block that engages in occult based practices and at the appropriate time one could literally see the spirits that had been woken in around there home, but they weren't allowed close to our house, they were just visible. How should I interpret this? Should I ruin my children's innocence? No. Should I be aware? yes. Do I need to make efforts to minister and counteract those who would practice the occult around me? yes. And if God is with us who Can be against us? We took the kids to a museum, prepped for the kids who may come to our house with plain pumpkins and glo lights. Next year I think I'll put in the work several months ahead and decorate the house as if it were a Star Trek Set. Go all Geeky. There's people who do that year round anyway.
                          A happy family is but an earlier heaven.
                          George Bernard Shaw

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