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Thread: 27 Christians Murdered In Texas Church...

  1. #281
    tWebber Adrift's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    There were a significant number of Christians as early as the second century who held to a less literal view of the millennium, according to Justin Martyr, himself a chiliast:

    ( https://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf...i.iv.lxxx.html )
    Right, but as Eusebius points out in his (in)famous critique of Papias,

    "Papias reproduces other stories communicated to him by word of mouth, together with some otherwise unknown parables and teachings of the Saviour, and other things of a more allegorical character. He says that after the resurrection of the dead there will be a period of a thousand years, when Christ's kingdom will be set up on this earth in material form. I suppose he got these notions by misinterpreting the apostolic accounts and failing to grasp what they had said in mystic and symbolic language. For he seems to have been a man of very small intelligence, to judge from his books. But it is partly due to him that the great majority of churchmen after him took the same view, relying on his early date; e.g. Irenaeus and several others, who clearly held the same opinion." - The History of the Church, Book 3:39

    So at least up until the 4th century, and probably as late as the 5th, if not later, it seemed to be the predominant view of the church.

  2. #282
    Dept. of Redundancy Dept. Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Could we maybe take this interesting but unrelated discussion elsewhere, please?

    1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

  3. #283
    tWebber Adrift's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    Could we maybe take this interesting but unrelated discussion elsewhere, please?
    Probably, but I'm not a mod, so I don't know about these things.

  4. #284
    Dept. of Redundancy Dept. Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adrift View Post
    Probably, but I'm not a mod, so I don't know about these things.
    Meh, no harm, no foul.

    1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

  5. #285
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adrift View Post
    Based on my own reading of early church writings, this seems to be more or less correct. While OBP may be technically correct that the amillennial view was the prominent view for most of church history, the early Christian writers seem to have been mostly Chiliasts.
    Yeah, I'd say that pre-Nicaea, the majority of writings which have survived lean Chiliast. Chiliasm was condemned as heretical somewhere around then, and Revelation mostly fell out of favor for a while, especially in the East (it was rehabilitated among Greeks in the 6th century by Andrew of Caesarea's commentary, and IIRC it was accepted by the Syrians a couple centuries later; the Armenian church, AFAIK, never did accept it as canonical).
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. St. John Chrysostom

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  6. #286
    tWebber Adrift's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    Yeah, I'd say that pre-Nicaea, the majority of writings which have survived lean Chiliast. Chiliasm was condemned as heretical somewhere around then, and Revelation mostly fell out of favor for a while, especially in the East (it was rehabilitated among Greeks in the 6th century by Andrew of Caesarea's commentary, and IIRC it was accepted by the Syrians a couple centuries later; the Armenian church, AFAIK, never did accept it as canonical).
    As I understand it, there's actually debate that Chiliasm was ever actually specifically deemed heretical in the 4th/5th centuries, though it's also my understanding that the Eastern Orthodox Church has already determined the matter settled (not so much the Roman Catholic Church, or a number of Protestant churches, of course).

  7. #287
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adrift View Post
    As I understand it, there's actually debate that Chiliasm was ever actually specifically deemed heretical in the 4th/5th centuries, though it's also my understanding that the Eastern Orthodox Church has already determined the matter settled (not so much the Roman Catholic Church, or a number of Protestant churches, of course).
    I understand why there would be debate, as I can't point to any conciliar condemnation of it (and in the East, that's what matters).
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. St. John Chrysostom

    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio

    I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

  8. Amen Adrift amen'd this post.

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