Should Al Franken Resign?

[Teallaura]

Ok, it doesn't look that way to me at all. It looks to me like his hands are hovering a bit away from her vest, and it's only forced perspective that might make it look like he's touching her. And that's a big deal, because while pretending to touch someone in a sexual manner without their awareness is creepy and disturbing, it's not nearly as disturbing as actually touching someone in a sexual manner without their awareness. Touch is powerful. I had assumed that everyone here was in agreement that she wasn't actually physically touched in the photo.

Oh, and by the way, assuming no turbulence, C-17s are actually pretty smooth. Or at least they were when I was taking them.

I reread part of the article. Tweeden alleges that he in fact touched her and that it was retaliatory for her avoidance of him subsequent to the kissing incident.

[Cow Poke]

I reread part of the article. Tweeden alleges that he in fact touched her and that it was retaliatory for her avoidance of him subsequent to the kissing incident.

But how could she know that if she was asleep? Does she allege that he touched her so firmly that it woke her up?

[Cow Poke]

Eh, whether she could feel it or not, touch is still a major matter of importance to me.

We don't disagree.

[Teallaura]

But how could she know that if she was asleep? Does she allege that he touched her so firmly that it woke her up?

She is evidently going by the picture and the word of the photographer if I understood correctly. No, she did not wake up.

But unless someone comes forward and says "She was playing along and in on the joke' which has not even come close to the facts so far, I don't think it matters.

[Cow Poke]

She is evidently going by the picture and the word of the photographer if I understood correctly. No, she did not wake up.

OK, makes sense.

But unless someone comes forward and says "She was playing along and in on the joke' which has not even come close to the facts so far, I don't think it matters.

And the fact that he posed for the photograph and made sure she had a copy of it.... what a creep.

[lilpixieofterror]

Technically, of course, he didn't touch her breasts, but probably touched the flak vest. A C-17 is not the smoothest flight, so even if his hands were "almost touching", it's hard to imagine he didn't touch the flak vest at some point.

A C-17 is pretty smooth for the most part. You might be thinking of a C-130. Those can drop 500 feet in altitude, in seconds.

[Cow Poke]

A C-17 is pretty smooth for the most part. You might be thinking of a C-130. Those can drop 500 feet in altitude, in seconds.

Maybe I just had a wild ride. I know my C's.

[alaskazimm]

Maybe I just had a wild ride. I know my C's.

But do you mind your P's and Q's?

[Cow Poke]

But do you mind your P's and Q's?

Not often enough.

[lilpixieofterror]

Maybe I just had a wild ride. I know my C's.

[Teallaura]

Any plane can hit turbulence and it doesn't matter - even if the plane had been unstable, that photo clearly shows him clutching (or clutching at) something he had no right to be doing.

Look, Franken hasn't put up a defense that would exonerate him (if true) about that photo. He apologized which confirms that he did something. The real issue is what he did prior to the picture. The fact that he made the picture substantiates somewhat the claim about the kiss.

More troubling are the additional accusations and the relatively recent time frame.

None of which should matter to his job unless and until he is either successfully sued or convicted.

[rogue06]

Any plane can hit turbulence and it doesn't matter - even if the plane had been unstable, that photo clearly shows him clutching (or clutching at) something he had no right to be doing.

Look, Franken hasn't put up a defense that would exonerate him (if true) about that photo. He apologized which confirms that he did something. The real issue is what he did prior to the picture. The fact that he made the picture substantiates somewhat the claim about the kiss.

More troubling are the additional accusations and the relatively recent time frame.

None of which should matter to his job unless and until he is either successfully sued or convicted.

He has not only not denied it but said it was meant as a joke. I posted Stephen Colbert's excellent response yesterday to that explanation:

It was Stephen Colbert that had the perfect take down for the defense that Franken is a comedian and trying to be funny (an excuse Franken himself has offered for the picture)

Source: Meyers, Colbert Skewer Al Franken’s Sexual Harassment Apology

Stuart Saves His FamilySource

© Copyright Original Source

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Meanwhile, two more women have stepped forward to accuse Franken of improper sexual conduct. From MSNBC:

Source: Two More Women Accuse Sen. Al Franken Of Inappropriate Touching

One woman told HuffPost that Franken had grabbed her backside at an event honoring womenThe story continues at the link below*]

Source

© Copyright Original Source

To be fair, IMHBAO, anonymous accusers should be taken with a grain of salt.

[carpedm9587]

I have been following the accusations against Mr. Franken. As more and more women come forward, I find the accusations against him increasingly credible. I hope they do hold a complete investigation, as I hope they do for Moore, Trump, Clinton, O'Reilly, Rose, Weinstein, Spacey, Hoffman, and every other person who has recently been identified as an abuser - as someone who used his/her (mostly/all? his) power to take advantage of or sexually impose themselves on others. We live in a world where women (and some men) have kept silent about this treatment for a long, long time, largely because of the attitudes they face when they come forward. It is refreshing to see more and more women and men feeling empowered to step forward, and more and more big names taking a fall (or at least a hit) as a result. It is true that I cannot take a stand about the guilt/innocence of any of these people, because I was not there. But it is not hard for me to believe that powerful people, especially men, develop a sense of entitlement, and abuse it.

This should not be a partisan issue. If we find ourselves defending those from "our team" and assuming guilt of those from "their team," something is very, very badly wrong.

[Cow Poke]

I have been following the accusations against Mr. Franken. As more and more women come forward, I find the accusations against him increasingly credible. I hope they do hold a complete investigation, as I hope they do for Moore, Trump, Clinton, O'Reilly, Rose, Weinstein, Spacey, Hoffman, and every other person who has recently been identified as an abuser - as someone who used his/her (mostly/all? his) power to take advantage of or sexually impose themselves on others. We live in a world where women (and some men) have kept silent about this treatment for a long, long time, largely because of the attitudes they face when they come forward. It is refreshing to see more and more women and men feeling empowered to step forward, and more and more big names taking a fall (or at least a hit) as a result. It is true that I cannot take a stand about the guilt/innocence of any of these people, because I was not there. But it is not hard for me to believe that powerful people, especially men, develop a sense of entitlement, and abuse it.

This should not be a partisan issue. If we find ourselves defending those from "our team" and assuming guilt of those from "their team," something is very, very badly wrong.

I think the media tends to be more liberal, and very aggressively goes after somebody like Moore, but Franken seems to get a pass (up till recently, anyway) because he issued a "cover my butt" apology.

So, yeah, the same standard should be applied to all, and the thing that really bothers me is this alleged slush fund that Washington DC biggies can draw on to pay off their accusers.

[Mountain Man]

...the thing that really bothers me is this alleged slush fund that Washington DC biggies can draw on to pay off their accusers.

And then they can slap them with a gag order so that they can never talk about it.