Should Al Franken Resign?

[Cow Poke]

Yep, if you read the text below the photos it actually says exactly that, "So is this okay? Not if she felt uncomfortable or did not want him to do it. She’s also sleeping so the dynamic was different- she wasn’t performing."

Again, does it redeem Franken, I don't think it necessarily does, but it does cast the whole situation in a different light (for me at least).

Well, yeah, but it's kinda like a trial for which I sat as jury foreman. A white woman had had sex with a black man a number of times, and one night he wanted sex and she said no. So he forced himself on her, even hitting her with a rubber mallet in the process.

A couple of little old blue haired women on the jury were laser focused on the fact that she had had sex with him multiple times, and, of course, they were incensed that it was a black man and a white woman. I pointed out that even if they had consensual sex a hundred times, when she says no, it's no.

They had a real hard time finding him guilty because "she's just as much at fault as he is". Not according to the law, of course.

But, yeah, I get what you're saying.

[rogue06]

I don't think a bad comedian like Al Franken should be in the Senate, but I got a better understanding of the environment that the photo was taken in when I saw the photograph in the context of other pictures released from the same event. https://imgur.com/gallery/FWPtO

In those photos you can see Leann herself engaging in behavior that might raise eyebrows today, like kissing an airman in the audience, smacking a performers butt while he's playing guitar, wrapping her legs around Robin Williams, and the like. I don't think these photos necessarily redeem Franken, but they certainly put that one picture of him mock grabbing her into a different context, or at least, they did for me.

Were there any other pictures of anyone taking advantage of someone while they slept? Personally, this sounds a lot like when some have excused his behavior because she posed for Playboy

[Mountain Man]

I don't think a bad comedian like Al Franken should be in the Senate, but I got a better understanding of the environment that the photo was taken in when I saw the photograph in the context of other pictures released from the same event. https://imgur.com/gallery/FWPtO

In those photos you can see Leann herself engaging in behavior that might raise eyebrows today, like kissing an airman in the audience, smacking a performers butt while he's playing guitar, wrapping her legs around Robin Williams, and the like. I don't think these photos necessarily redeem Franken, but they certainly put that one picture of him mock grabbing her into a different context, or at least, they did for me.

Photos from a public stage performance versus Franken groping a sleeping woman without her consent? Sorry, but this sounds suspiciously like an attempt at a "she was asking for it" defense. There's simply no comparison, and trying to make Franken's actions seem somehow acceptable by putting them in "context" is disgusting. There is NO context in which Franken's conduct is defensible.

[Roy]

A couple of little old blue haired women on the jury were laser focused on ...

In the UK it's prohibited for jurors to disclose the contents of discussions that take place within the jury.

Is US law different?

[Cow Poke]

In the UK it's prohibited for jurors to disclose the contents of discussions that take place within the jury.

Is US law different?

During the trial, it's prohibited. After the trial, people write books!

[Mountain Man]

In the UK it's prohibited for jurors to disclose the contents of discussions that take place within the jury.

Is US law different?

Yes. Jurors are generally prohibited from discussing an ongoing trial, but once a verdict has been reached, they are free to discuss it if they wish.

[Mountain Man]

Hmm...

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The New York Post received two separate photographs of disgraced Senator Al Franken (D-MN) appearing to grope Arianna Huffington’s butt and breast during a photo shoot in 2000.

A source at the shoot told the Post, “Franken was clowning around, but it really isn’t funny. That’s his tactic,” the source added, “pretend like it’s all a big joke.”

The Post’s source further claims that Franken’s groping made the former media mogul uncomfortable. “Arianna was pushing his hands away. He was groping her. There was some fun attached to it, but she wasn’t enjoying it. She definitely told him to stop and pushed him away.”

http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...east-and-butt/

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Huffington claims the description isn't accurate, but she also has a history of covering up cases of sexual harassment while she was head of the Huffington Post.

https://gizmodo.com/arianna-huffington-ignored-sexual-misconduct-at-the-huf-1820389889

At any rate, it certainly shows a pattern of behavior on Franken's part.

[Mountain Man]

There's also the picture of him with Joy Behar.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywo...st-rob-reiner/

So that's his MO, he's a serial groper who tries to pass it off as a joke. I'd like to see him try that "joke" on my wife. He'd get a mouthful of her fist in return.

[Cow Poke]

A source at the shoot told the Post, “Franken was clowning around, but it really isn’t funny. That’s his tactic,” the source added, “pretend like it’s all a big joke.”

Maybe it's "his thing" - like that moron who licks people because "it's my thing".

[Adrift]

Were there any other pictures of anyone taking advantage of someone while they slept? Personally, this sounds a lot like when some have excused his behavior because she posed for Playboy

Not that I'm aware of, but for me, personally, it puts his actions into perspective. If everyone is flirtatiously horsing around both onstage and backstage, I can imagine a scenario where Franken crossed the line when the photo was taken, and others at the time didn't think it was that big of a deal. It doesn't make what he did right, in my opinion, but I have to admit that it does contextualize the event for me. It probably softens my view of the circumstances.

[Roy]

During the trial, it's prohibited. After the trial, people write books!

Strange.

[Adrift]

Photos from a public stage performance versus Franken groping a sleeping woman without her consent? Sorry, but this sounds suspiciously like an attempt at a "she was asking for it" defense. There's simply no comparison, and trying to make Franken's actions seem somehow acceptable by putting them in "context" is disgusting. There is NO context in which Franken's conduct is defensible.

I'm sorry, but it does for me. To be clear here, going by the photographic evidence, Leann wasn't raped, nor was she literally physically molested.. Like I said, I still believe what Franken did was wrong, that he crossed a line, but this does contextualize things for me. If my own personal feelings about this based on gaining some understanding of the context makes you think I'm some sort of rape apologist for Franken as you're now trying to paint me, then I suppose I'm just going to have to live with that. I think that's ridiculous, but oh well. I can't change the fact that my view of the situation has been softened, even if I still find his behavior out of line.

[Teallaura]

I don't see how you can entertain the possibility that Franken could be innocent in light of that damning photograph.

They were both in SNL - and as I've said repeatedly, it's NOT irrefutable.

I think the guy is guilty - but that's a far cry from proving it in a court.

[Teallaura]

Not that I'm aware of, but for me, personally, it puts his actions into perspective. If everyone is flirtatiously horsing around both onstage and backstage, I can imagine a scenario where Franken crossed the line when the photo was taken, and others at the time didn't think it was that big of a deal. It doesn't make what he did right, in my opinion, but I have to admit that it does contextualize the event for me. It probably softens my view of the circumstances.

Actually, I agree that it provides context but it's irrelevant UNLESS she did in fact consent. Since neither Franken nor Tweeden have made any such assertion it doesn't matter if they were horsing around earlier or even if she'd permitted groping in the past (which is NOT alleged anywhere) - it only matters that he touched her inappropriately without her consent.

It also doesn't matter if he'd groped half of New York - or never touched a woman before in his life. All that matters is what he did at that time and whether or not she gave consent or any reason to believe that she would have consented. Since that is not alleged by either party, we're on to the part in contention.

[rogue06]

Hmm...

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The New York Post received two separate photographs of disgraced Senator Al Franken (D-MN) appearing to grope Arianna Huffington’s butt and breast during a photo shoot in 2000.

A source at the shoot told the Post, “Franken was clowning around, but it really isn’t funny. That’s his tactic,” the source added, “pretend like it’s all a big joke.”

The Post’s source further claims that Franken’s groping made the former media mogul uncomfortable. “Arianna was pushing his hands away. He was groping her. There was some fun attached to it, but she wasn’t enjoying it. She definitely told him to stop and pushed him away.”

http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...east-and-butt/

----------

Huffington claims the description isn't accurate, but she also has a history of covering up cases of sexual harassment while she was head of the Huffington Post.

https://gizmodo.com/arianna-huffingt...huf-1820389889

At any rate, it certainly shows a pattern of behavior on Franken's part.

It was Stephen Colbert that had the perfect take down for the defense that Franken is a comedian and trying to be funny (an excuse Franken himself has offered for the picture)

Source: Meyers, Colbert Skewer Al Franken’s Sexual Harassment Apology

Colbert devoted time to Franken’s initial succinct apology — the senator said the photo “was intended to be funny, but wasn’t” — in the Late Show’s opening monologue Thursday night. “Okay, intended to be funny but wasn’t? Your movie Stuart Saves His Family was ‘intended to be funny, but wasn’t.’ That photo was intended to embarrass her. That’s why he did it while she was asleep.”



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