Originally posted by carpedm9587
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NOT saying anything about any religion or any god does not say "there is no god." It simply says nothing.
A period of silence before each session lets each member exercise their faith as they see fit, prayer, meditation, etc. The same in a school. Likewise, the public school system is not atheist or agnostic (oer it shouldn't be); it is mute (or it should be). I would take as much exception to a teacher prosletizing students with an atheist or agnostic agenda as I would to a Christian or Muslim or Judaic agenda. And discussion of religions is not prohibited, if it is in the cotext of a compartive religion class, or a history of literature class, or a history of the world that focuses on when and how each religion originated.
What is NOT ok is for anyone to promote their own belief (atheist, agnostic, or theistic) using government resources or as a representative of a government or government-funded institution. So - to be clear, things I think SHOULD be permitted include:
- comparative religion classes
- study of religious books as literature
- a student privately praying at the start of a class, or in the school cafeteria.
- room set aside for any group to use as a "quiet space" as they see fit (meditation, prayer, even a religious ritual, etc.)
- a student sitting at a table in front of the school before or after school with religious tracts for distribution (as long as they are passive, only addressing students that come to THEM).
- a student wearing clothing with religious symbolism (I used to have a jean jacket I wore to school with a big Px symbol on the back and "Jesus Saves" embroidered around it. Made it myself )
- a teacher or parent hosting a prayer service before or after school time in that "quiet room" (THAT really irritates my liberal friends! )
- excused dismissal for religious observances
- religious music played by the chorus or school band (as long as it is not in the context of ritual and is simply another form of music)
Things I think SHOULD NOT be permitted include:
- the principal leading a student assembly with a prayer (students are required to attend - not appropriate)
- a teacher requiring a moment of prayer at the start of class (same thing)
- ANYONE actively prosletyzing ANY belief system on school grounds. (students have to be there, and active prosletyzing means they may not be able to avoid it if they do not wish to be so exposed)
- Any school official sponsoring prayer services or rituals during school hours
You get the idea. Government resources should never be used to promote a religion
What is NOT ok is for anyone to promote their own belief (atheist, agnostic, or theistic) using government resources or as a representative of a government or government-funded institution. So - to be clear, things I think SHOULD be permitted include:
- comparative religion classes
- study of religious books as literature
- a student privately praying at the start of a class, or in the school cafeteria.
- room set aside for any group to use as a "quiet space" as they see fit (meditation, prayer, even a religious ritual, etc.)
- a student sitting at a table in front of the school before or after school with religious tracts for distribution (as long as they are passive, only addressing students that come to THEM).
- a student wearing clothing with religious symbolism (I used to have a jean jacket I wore to school with a big Px symbol on the back and "Jesus Saves" embroidered around it. Made it myself )
- a teacher or parent hosting a prayer service before or after school time in that "quiet room" (THAT really irritates my liberal friends! )
- excused dismissal for religious observances
- religious music played by the chorus or school band (as long as it is not in the context of ritual and is simply another form of music)
Things I think SHOULD NOT be permitted include:
- the principal leading a student assembly with a prayer (students are required to attend - not appropriate)
- a teacher requiring a moment of prayer at the start of class (same thing)
- ANYONE actively prosletyzing ANY belief system on school grounds. (students have to be there, and active prosletyzing means they may not be able to avoid it if they do not wish to be so exposed)
- Any school official sponsoring prayer services or rituals during school hours
You get the idea. Government resources should never be used to promote a religion
(including atheism or agnosticism) in a context where people have no choice but to comply or participate or be subjected to it.
The money issue is a harder thing. From the "use" side, allowing a student to use the money in a school of their choice does not violate any of my prohibitions listed above, so you would think, "why not?" After all, only the student is affected and they are going where they want to go.
The problem isn't on the use side - it is on the suppply side. It means some part of my tax dollars aere being used to pay for the religious education of a belief system I do not agree with.
The money issue is a harder thing. From the "use" side, allowing a student to use the money in a school of their choice does not violate any of my prohibitions listed above, so you would think, "why not?" After all, only the student is affected and they are going where they want to go.
The problem isn't on the use side - it is on the suppply side. It means some part of my tax dollars aere being used to pay for the religious education of a belief system I do not agree with.
Would you be comfortable if a satanic school was opened, and your tax dollars were used to fund students attending this school and be indoctrinated into those beliefs? Or if an explicitly atheistic school was opened, and your tax dollars were used to indoctrinate children into atheism?
For that reason, I am not in favor of a voucher program. I think our schools, as government institutions, should be mum on systems of religious belief, and people should take responsibility for themselves if they want their children indoctrinated in one belief system or another. Public schools should be focused on basic knowledge (3 Rs) and the skills a child needs to get a job and function in society. It should be mute on the issue of gods and belief systems.
One of the few things Trump advocates that I applaud is the idea that not everybody needs to go to college. We need the 'vocational classes' we used to have - auto mechanics, welding, electricity, home economics, wood shop....
Ah, the days gone bye!
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