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Thread: Need advice from Christians well-versed in both philosophy and theology!

  1. #11
    tWebber Faber's Avatar
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    I was an atheist by the time I was a senior in high school, in 1968. Not the militant type; I pretty much kept it to myself, until I came across some Christian classmates who invited me to youth group activities and church. For several months they tried to convert me through apologetics. (Much of which I thought was sheer nonsense, and still do.) Eventually it was the conviction of the Holy Spirit and the preaching of the Word that convicted me. Since then, I often refer to 1 Corinthians 1:18-29. I had looked on the preaching as foolishness. But it was because of that foolishness of preaching the Word of God that I eventually gave up my unbelief and trusted in Jesus.

    I don't disregard apologetics, though. I enjoy reading it, as long as it isn't some of the nonsense which some have dreamed up. In my case, it wasn't apologetics which converted me. But I have a friend who tells me that it was apologetics that the Lord used to convert him. God can use whatever He wishes.

    In many things I am still a skeptic. I question much of what I hear from Bible teachers on radio and even in my own church. I flat-out reject a lot of it. Sure there things in the Bible which I don't understand. But I don't allow my skepticism to stand in the way of my faith in the Lord Jesus.

    I hope this helps.

  2. #12
    tWebber Obsidian's Avatar
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    Why is it that you're logging on to a Christian forum, to ask for assistance in believing in Christianity? Because you intuitively understand that the other religions are false?

    I don't recommend the route of haunted houses, because I think participating in such things is arguably the sin of necromancy. It may allow the devil to get his hooks into you even worse than now. Looking into Teallaura's arguments is your better bet.

    Or you could try googling "Fulfilled Bible Prophecy."

  3. #13
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaney777 View Post
    That's pretty accurate. Or rather, I want to know if and how I can find out the true worldview.
    Belief is ultimately a choice. You examine evidence for some claim, do some research, decide if the sources are reliable or not and then you choose to believe. Like man made global warming for instance. There are people on both sides of the issue. It is up to you to decide which ones to believe. Is mankind actually changing the climate, or could it just be a natural cycle of warming, just like the ice ages were global cooling. There is evidence for both views, but you need to examine that evidence yourself, become informed and then decide what you want to believe. There is no absolute indisputable proof.

    Same with Christianity. It is a religion based on evidence. There are historical accounts and claims. The bible itself is not one book but 66 of them compiled by various authors over thousands of years who did not know each other. So does one author predict or prophesy something that came true and is written about by another author hundreds or thousands of years later? Do the authors have any reason to lie? Are their claims made by people outside of the bible that corroborate the bible? Are there any archeological evidences that back up what is written in the bible?

    So do some research, then you have to make a decision. Just like any other belief you have.

  4. #14
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obsidian View Post
    Why is it that you're logging on to a Christian forum, to ask for assistance in believing in Christianity? Because you intuitively understand that the other religions are false?
    It could be that he's looking into those options too, in the appropriate forum.
    I don't recommend the route of haunted houses, because I think participating in such things is arguably the sin of necromancy. It may allow the devil to get his hooks into you even worse than now. Looking into Teallaura's arguments is your better bet.
    Agreed that he shouldn't, because he has no protection.
    Or you could try googling "Fulfilled Bible Prophecy."
    That's rather more likely to get him a bunch of nutter websites than anything useful.
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio

    I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

  5. Amen Shaney777, Rushing Jaws amen'd this post.
  6. #15
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cerebrum123 View Post
    I know you want to see something supernatural, but I wouldn't go that route. Then again I can still vividly remember the terror of my own encounter with such evil forces. I was far from the only one to have such encounters at my old house, but I'm the only one who saw it directly rather than hearing it.

    Perhaps something like Craig Keener's Miracles would be a better place to start.
    The Theology Program is decent.
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio

    I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

  7. Amen Shaney777 amen'd this post.
  8. #16
    Professor Cerebrum123's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    Yeah, but I was trying to think of something along the lines of more recent works on the supernatural, but without the darker side to it. I know it's not the same as seeing a miracle for yourself, but seeing credible testimony is the next best thing.

  9. Amen Teallaura, Shaney777 amen'd this post.
  10. #17
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teallaura View Post
    I'm going to try from a different tack. Do you believe the Jesus Christ existed (lived and died)? Here there is little debate - even most atheist historians accept the existence of Christ.

    Do you believe He meant what He said? Here too, little argument.

    Do you believe He was rational? Once again, this isn't debated seriously by scholars based on His words as recorded.

    Do you believe He was a liar? This is a point of contention but doesn't stand scrutiny well.

    So, if you do believe He existed, was rational, meant what He said and wasn't a liar, then how do you substantiate your doubt in His promise that if you believe in Him - that means believing His promises, not His existence - you will be saved?
    I tend to believe that he was a real person in history, yes. Maybe where the doubt comes in is with the most important part: his resurrection. If there is no resurrection, he was merely a wise teacher. How is the debate situation on the historicity of His resurrection?

  11. #18
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cerebrum123 View Post
    I know you want to see something supernatural, but I wouldn't go that route. Then again I can still vividly remember the terror of my own encounter with such evil forces. I was far from the only one to have such encounters at my old house, but I'm the only one who saw it directly rather than hearing it.

    Perhaps something like Craig Keener's Miracles would be a better place to start.
    What happened at your old house? If you don't feel comfortable answering, I understand.

    And wow, that seems like a respected book. I'll check it out!

  12. #19
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faber View Post
    I was an atheist by the time I was a senior in high school, in 1968. Not the militant type; I pretty much kept it to myself, until I came across some Christian classmates who invited me to youth group activities and church. For several months they tried to convert me through apologetics. (Much of which I thought was sheer nonsense, and still do.) Eventually it was the conviction of the Holy Spirit and the preaching of the Word that convicted me. Since then, I often refer to 1 Corinthians 1:18-29. I had looked on the preaching as foolishness. But it was because of that foolishness of preaching the Word of God that I eventually gave up my unbelief and trusted in Jesus.

    I don't disregard apologetics, though. I enjoy reading it, as long as it isn't some of the nonsense which some have dreamed up. In my case, it wasn't apologetics which converted me. But I have a friend who tells me that it was apologetics that the Lord used to convert him. God can use whatever He wishes.

    In many things I am still a skeptic. I question much of what I hear from Bible teachers on radio and even in my own church. I flat-out reject a lot of it. Sure there things in the Bible which I don't understand. But I don't allow my skepticism to stand in the way of my faith in the Lord Jesus.

    I hope this helps.
    Conviction... I have felt really, really convicted during preaching before, but I could never connect it to being something "otherwordly." It seemed like a common emotional response to someone pointing out your worse faults, you know? But you say that the Holy Spirit and teaching is what did it for you. That's precisely what I am looking to happen with me...just not sure when that might occur.

  13. #20
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obsidian View Post
    Why is it that you're logging on to a Christian forum, to ask for assistance in believing in Christianity? Because you intuitively understand that the other religions are false?

    I don't recommend the route of haunted houses, because I think participating in such things is arguably the sin of necromancy. It may allow the devil to get his hooks into you even worse than now. Looking into Teallaura's arguments is your better bet.

    Or you could try googling "Fulfilled Bible Prophecy."
    I grew up in a Christian home, so the Christian hell is more "real" to me than the hells of other religions.

    Where can I find Teallaura's arguments? I assume they are involved with hauntings?

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