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  • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    I'll concede that Jesus gave away free health-care, and Obama did not. Obama strong-armed Peter into paying for Paul's healthcare, which is not exactly Christian ethics. Claiming Jesus was a socialist is an epic misreading of scripture - and claiming that Jesus was anti-war sort of flies in the face of the Apocalypse.
    To say that Peter's getting robbed, we'd have to accept taxation as theft. I don't think that's where you were going, and if you were, theft of services is a crime, too.

    Low income individuals get tax benefits for health care through the ACA. Corporations get tax benefits for offering health care through the tax code. I'm okay with both of these, though I'd still prefer to see everyone covered.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by lao tzu View Post
      To say that Peter's getting robbed, we'd have to accept taxation as theft. I don't think that's where you were going, and if you were, theft of services is a crime, too.
      I avoided terms like "robbed" and "theft" because those denote illegality. It is nonetheless done against my will. Christian ethics is about voluntary giving, which I am happy to do.
      Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

      Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
      sigpic
      I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

      Comment


      • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
        I avoided terms like "robbed" and "theft" because those denote illegality. It is nonetheless done against my will. Christian ethics is about voluntary giving, which I am happy to do.
        that
        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

        Comment


        • Just to note, while I do not think the so-called "main stream media" is a slanted as it is often portrayed to be by those on the right, that doesn't mean I don't recognize that some main stream outlets have a left lean and sometimes "pull a Brietbart" and structure their titles to get eyes in an unbalanced way. A case in point, this USA Today headline. If you're just scanning headlines, seeing "Late night tears into Trump following 'total disaster' State of the Union" leaves the impression that the SOTU last night was a "total disaster." In fact, it was one of the better speeches we've heard from Trump. Normally, I find listening to him to be akin to listening to fingernail scratching a blackboard. Between his boasting, false statements, false accusations, and his inability to articulate a reasonably structured English sentence, I usually end up abandoning ship long before he is done.

          That was not the case this time. He stuck to message, had a few positive things to say, and the false statements were significantly reduced (this tax cut is not the "biggest ever" by any stretch of the imagination. There are at least six others in the past 4 decades that were larger). He may even see a bit of an uptick of his approval rating as a result. Now let's see if he maintains this model, or simply goes back to the amazing chaos of the first year.
          The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

          I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

          Comment


          • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
            Just to note, while I do not think the so-called "main stream media" is a slanted as it is often portrayed to be by those on the right, that doesn't mean I don't recognize that some main stream outlets have a left lean and sometimes "pull a Brietbart" and structure their titles to get eyes in an unbalanced way. A case in point, this USA Today headline. If you're just scanning headlines, seeing "Late night tears into Trump following 'total disaster' State of the Union" leaves the impression that the SOTU last night was a "total disaster." In fact, it was one of the better speeches we've heard from Trump. Normally, I find listening to him to be akin to listening to fingernail scratching a blackboard. Between his boasting, false statements, false accusations, and his inability to articulate a reasonably structured English sentence, I usually end up abandoning ship long before he is done.

            That was not the case this time. He stuck to message, had a few positive things to say, and the false statements were significantly reduced (this tax cut is not the "biggest ever" by any stretch of the imagination. There are at least six others in the past 4 decades that were larger). He may even see a bit of an uptick of his approval rating as a result. Now let's see if he maintains this model, or simply goes back to the amazing chaos of the first year.
            You can't judge a news article solely by the headline - especially in this age of "clickbait". Headlines are meant to grab attention. They can mislead. It is what is in the article that counts. That is why I keep arguing about the Brietbart article. Roy and others just harp on the headline which could be read incorrectly (grammar in headlines is not always so great either) and ignoring what the article said.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
              Just to note, while I do not think the so-called "main stream media" is a slanted as it is often portrayed to be by those on the right, that doesn't mean I don't recognize that some main stream outlets have a left lean and sometimes "pull a Brietbart" and structure their titles to get eyes in an unbalanced way. A case in point, this USA Today headline. If you're just scanning headlines, seeing "Late night tears into Trump following 'total disaster' State of the Union" leaves the impression that the SOTU last night was a "total disaster." In fact, it was one of the better speeches we've heard from Trump. Normally, I find listening to him to be akin to listening to fingernail scratching a blackboard. Between his boasting, false statements, false accusations, and his inability to articulate a reasonably structured English sentence, I usually end up abandoning ship long before he is done.

              That was not the case this time. He stuck to message, had a few positive things to say, and the false statements were significantly reduced (this tax cut is not the "biggest ever" by any stretch of the imagination. There are at least six others in the past 4 decades that were larger). He may even see a bit of an uptick of his approval rating as a result. Now let's see if he maintains this model, or simply goes back to the amazing chaos of the first year.
              Every time he actually reads from the prompter and doesn’t ad lib people say he’s reached a turning point & may actually start acting presidential. It never lasts, so I wouldn’t hold your breath.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                You can't judge a news article solely by the headline - especially in this age of "clickbait". Headlines are meant to grab attention. They can mislead. It is what is in the article that counts. That is why I keep arguing about the Brietbart article. Roy and others just harp on the headline which could be read incorrectly (grammar in headlines is not always so great either) and ignoring what the article said.
                I read what the article said, and I maintain that the article itself is structured to be missleading. Most people reading it (I have actually printed it, blanked out the source, and asked several people across the political divide to tell me what they think the article is saying) will interpret it as has been described here: that a mob of 1,000 muslim (implied) men were chanting a muslim chant (which is what I mean by implied), firing rockets, etc. So far, 100% of the people who responded to my little test read it exactly that way.

                This is why I eschew Brietbart. The work involved in seeing through the fairly extreme political slant is simply more work than I want to do. I do not have to work anywhere near that hard with WSJ, Reuters, BBC, ABC, etc. That is why I refer to them as "soft slant" outlets, vs. Brietbart's, Mother Jones', The Blaze's, and Jezebel's "hard slant." Fox news is a bit of an enigma to me. The actual news outlet is "soft right." Their commentaries tend to be "hard right." It's why I don't waste my time with Hannity. I also don't waste my time with Maddow. I like Cooper's style, but he is drifting more and more from "soft left" to "hard left" with the advent of the Trump administration.
                The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                Comment


                • Originally posted by EvoUK View Post
                  Every time he actually reads from the prompter and doesn’t ad lib people say he’s reached a turning point & may actually start acting presidential. It never lasts, so I wouldn’t hold your breath.
                  Probably true. He's also clearly less comfortable, and a lot more boring. I think his fans like his rough/ad-libbed/unscripted style. I prefer a well structured, and well thought-out speech delived by a good speaker. Maybe it's because I was never much for cheerleaders and rallies. I find them pointless. Give me a well structured speech that provides me with information I need/want. I'll take care of my own enthusiasm, thank you.
                  The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                  I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
                    Probably true. He's also clearly less comfortable, and a lot more boring. I think his fans like his rough/ad-libbed/unscripted style. I prefer a well structured, and well thought-out speech delived by a good speaker. Maybe it's because I was never much for cheerleaders and rallies. I find them pointless. Give me a well structured speech that provides me with information I need/want. I'll take care of my own enthusiasm, thank you.
                    On the other hand, the Dem Response made Trump's 'performance' look good, IMOHBAO.
                    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                      On the other hand, the Dem Responses made Trump's 'performance' look good, IMOHBAO.
                      Fixed that for you. One apparently wasn't sufficient, so they went with several.
                      Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                      Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                      sigpic
                      I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                        Fixed that for you. One apparently wasn't sufficient, so they went with several.
                        OH? I only saw Kennedy's, and he looked like he was trying way too hard to be "an orator".
                        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                          On the other hand, the Dem Response made Trump's 'performance' look good, IMOHBAO.
                          Can't comment - didn't see it.
                          The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                          I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                            OH? I only saw Kennedy's, and he looked like he was trying way too hard to be "an orator".
                            WaPo's Ed Rogers counts six (although a couple would seem to be redundant):

                            Source: Ed Rogers

                            Democrats scheduled six separate responses to the president's address - the official response, the Spanish-language response, the Sen. Bernie Sanders response, the socialist response, the Rep. Maxine Waters response and the celebrity response.

                            © Copyright Original Source

                            Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                            Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                            sigpic
                            I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
                              Can't comment - didn't see it.
                              It just seemed so contrived - It's like a preacher who doesn't really have the experience, but tries to add all the little "special emphasis" stuff, changing tone of voice.... it just seemed 'forced'.
                              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                                WaPo's Ed Rogers counts six (although a couple would seem to be redundant):

                                Source: Ed Rogers

                                Democrats scheduled six separate responses to the president's address - the official response, the Spanish-language response, the Sen. Bernie Sanders response, the socialist response, the Rep. Maxine Waters response and the celebrity response.

                                © Copyright Original Source

                                Interesting -- isn't there usually one "official" (so to speak) response? I thought Kennedy's was "it".
                                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                                Comment

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