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Does an Omniscient Creator Lead to Fatalism?

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  • Originally posted by 37818 View Post
    Well it is in evidence, that Christians claim to know God.
    IOW it's evidence of unsubstantiated claims.

    Well, citing quantum mechanics as you have is just a generality. What was the definitive experiment?
    There are so many, the double-slit experiment, which displays the fundamentally probabilistic nature of quantum mechanical phenomena is one, but I suggest you read up on it.

    https://www.livescience.com/33816-qu...planation.html
    “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
      IOW it's evidence of unsubstantiated claims.
      Unsubstantiated in what way? The NT writers claim believers know God is in evidence at the very least. (Some examples being, 2 Thessalonians 1:8, 1 John 4:7, and so on.)


      There are so many, the double-slit experiment, which displays the fundamentally probabilistic nature of quantum mechanical phenomena is one, but I suggest you read up on it.
      https://www.livescience.com/33816-qu...planation.html
      The physical interference is what is known to change the out come.
      . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

      . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

      Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

      Comment


      • Originally posted by 37818 View Post
        Unsubstantiated in what way? The NT writers claim believers know God is in evidence at the very least. (Some examples being, 2 Thessalonians 1:8, 1 John 4:7, and so on.)
        Asserted claims do not necessarily equate to substantiated evidence.

        The physical interference is what is known to change the out come.
        Please explain, taking into account the 'Heisenberg uncertainty principle'.
        “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
          Asserted claims do not necessarily equate to substantiated evidence.
          But [genuine] Christians today do know God.


          Please explain, taking into account the 'Heisenberg uncertainty principle'.
          Both the interference pattern and to slot pattern manifest in accordance with the principle. The two slot pattern the particle is observed as the particle not as in its wave from. Location versus momentum.
          https://blogs.scientificamerican.com...actually-show/
          . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

          . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

          Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

          Comment


          • Originally posted by 37818 View Post
            But [genuine] Christians today do know God.
            You say so.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by 37818 View Post
              But [genuine] Christians today do know God.
              So they say, why should I believe them?

              Both the interference pattern and to slot pattern manifest in accordance with the principle. The two slot pattern the particle is observed as the particle not as in its wave from. Location versus momentum.
              https://blogs.scientificamerican.com...actually-show/
              The point is that for Quantum Physics nature is intrinsically probabilistic, not deterministic as in Classical Physics.
              “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
                So they say, why should I believe them?
                Why don't you believe them?



                The point is that for Quantum Physics nature is intrinsically probabilistic, not deterministic as in Classical Physics.
                The probabilities are not unknowable.
                . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

                . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

                Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Doug Shaver View Post
                  You say so.
                  Not just my say so, but the claim as found in the NT.
                  . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

                  . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

                  Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by 37818 View Post
                    Not just my say so, but the claim as found in the NT.
                    Your say-so, their say-so, what's the difference? I have no more reason to take their word for it than I do yours. Why should I believe any of you?

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by 37818 View Post
                      Not just my say so, but the claim as found in the NT.
                      The only god that you know is the one that you read about and exists now only as an imagination in your head, 37.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by 37818 View Post
                        Why don't you believe them?
                        I have no good reason to believe them.

                        The probabilities are not unknowable.[/QUOTE]

                        Probability is not certainty. Things that happen in quantum are guided only by probability, and we can know only how things will behave on the average.
                        “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
                          I have no good reason to believe them.
                          You deny God for the same excuse.


                          Probability is not certainty. Things that happen in quantum are guided only by probability, and we can know only how things will behave on the average.
                          The simple probability of flipping a coin, it is known to be a 50/50 chance. The outcome per flip is indeed unknown. But the odds are known. Quantum probabilities are known to be such and such. Measuring the location of a particle is known to change the outcome.
                          Last edited by 37818; 06-13-2018, 11:09 AM.
                          . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

                          . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

                          Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
                            Probability is not certainty. Things that happen in quantum are guided only by probability, and we can know only how things will behave on the average.
                            I do not agree with the wording here. There is no reason to believe Quantum behavior is 'guided by probability.' Probability as a property of Quantum behavior as an observation from the human perspective.
                            Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                            Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                            But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                            go with the flow the river knows . . .

                            Frank

                            I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                            Comment

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