Do you believe in zombies?

[Sparko]

Sounds like an excuse to me for someone who really doesn't want to die who's talking to naive people. But none of that answers to the post it's in reply to anyway.

Yes it does. When we die our spirit goes to be with God. We await the final judgement time when we will be given glorified bodies and become whole again. As far as those who don't belong to God, like yourself, the bible seems to indicate that there is a place similar to hell where you go to wait (parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man Luke 16:19-31). After the final judgment you and your immortal new body will be thrown into actual hell for eternity.

[JimL]

Yes it does. When we die our spirit goes to be with God.

So, if the saints spirits went to be with god, why did they emerge from out of their tombs when god made new bodies for them to slip into?

We await the final judgement time when we will be given glorified bodies and become whole again.

What have all the spirits been doing these thousands of years while waiting for their new bodies.

As far as those who don't belong to God, like yourself, the bible seems to indicate that there is a place similar to hell where you go to wait (parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man Luke 16:19-31). After the final judgment you and your immortal new body will be thrown into actual hell for eternity.

So, you believe in an actual hell, like with fire and all? But the immortal part is kinda cool.

[Sparko]

So, if the saints spirits went to be with god, why did they emerge from out of their tombs when god made new bodies for them to slip into?

God resurrected them. We went over this already.

What have all the spirits been doing these thousands of years while waiting for their new bodies.

Playing bingo.

So, you believe in an actual hell, like with fire and all? But the immortal part is kinda cool.

I suppose that was a bad pun. Nothing cool about it for you JimL.

[One Bad Pig]

Well you say the spirit never dies anyway, so what is it that's brought back to life?

The body.

So the process is the same, it's just that the saints slipped back into corruptible bodies, and at the general resurrection christian spirits will slip into incorruptible bodies?

No. The spirits of the saints slipped back into corruptible bodies. At the general resurrection all spirits will slip back into corruptible bodies which will be changed into incorruptible bodies.

Well the spirits of the saints must of been hanging out in the tombs along with their decayed old bodies so god must have just puffed a new body in there for all of them to put on. Basically that's how god does things anyway right, just puffs what he thinks into existence?

I'm not sure where the spirits of the saints hang out. God created everything in the beginning. There's no need to create new bodies when the old material is still there.

The same body? You mean god puts together the same exact atoms in the same exact way? But how could that be if they are to be incorruptible? There must be something more to it than that, no?

After resurrection, our bodies will be changed somehow in order to be incorruptible. I don't know any more than that.

But aren't you saying that we all get back our old bodies-recomposition?

Yes.

[Adrift]

I'm not sure where the spirits of the saints hang out. God created everything in the beginning.

I'm not sure what the Eastern Orthodox view on this is, but my view is that before Christ's death, Sheol contained both the righteous and wicked dead, which itself was divided between a place of comfort and discomfort (demonstrated in Jesus' parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man).

I think after Jesus died he went down into Sheol and brought out the righteous dead to be in his presence, where they remain in conscious repose until the general resurrection. The wicked dead, I think, probably stay in the same uncomfortable side of Sheol till the day of judgement.

[Sparko]

I'm not sure what the Eastern Orthodox view on this is, but my view is that before Christ's death, Sheol contained both the righteous and wicked dead, which itself was divided between a place of comfort and discomfort (demonstrated in Jesus' parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man).

I think after Jesus died he went down into Sheol and brought out the righteous dead to be in his presence, where they remain in conscious repose until the general resurrection. The wicked dead, I think, probably stay in the same uncomfortable side of Sheol till the day of judgement.

Yeah that's my understanding too. The bad side of Sheol is like jail, and hell is prison. The wicked are held there until the judgment and then sentence is passed and they are consigned to hell.

[JimL]

The body.

No. The spirits of the saints slipped back into corruptible bodies. At the general resurrection all spirits will slip back into corruptible bodies which will be changed into incorruptible bodies.

I'm not sure where the spirits of the saints hang out. God created everything in the beginning. There's no need to create new bodies when the old material is still there.

After resurrection, our bodies will be changed somehow in order to be incorruptible. I don't know any more than that.

Yes.

Okay, starting to get it. Our bodies are alive in a sense even without our spirits inhabiting them, sort of like zombies I guess, but at some point they die at which time the spirits inhabiting them flies off to wherever to be with god or something. So, the spirits hang out for thousands of years with god or whatever, until at some point, god will resurrect, or recompose their old bodies, and the spirits will come and hop back into them, and only then, once all the spirits are back in their old bodies, will god turn those corruptible bodies into incorruptible ones. Is that about it?

[Sparko]

[One Bad Pig]

Okay, starting to get it. Our bodies are alive in a sense even without our spirits inhabiting them, sort of like zombies I guess,

I have no idea where you're getting this from.

but at some point they die at which time the spirits inhabiting them flies off to wherever to be with god or something. So, the spirits hang out for thousands of years with god or whatever, until at some point, god will resurrect, or recompose their old bodies, and the spirits will come and hop back into them, and only then, once all the spirits are back in their old bodies, will god turn those corruptible bodies into incorruptible ones. Is that about it?

More or less, though the resurrection of everyone will happen all at once, those still kicking around will meet them in the air, and everyone will be changed at once.

[Sparko]

I have no idea where you're getting this from.

More or less, though the resurrection of everyone will happen all at once, those still kicking around will meet them in the air, and everyone will be changed at once.

His question shows he is just acting stupid again. He knows how spirits and bodies work in the traditional sense. He has been around long enough to pick that up just from popular media. To pretend to be ignorant of it is him being fake again. Trolling.

Next I expect him to say something like, "well how do spirits eat if they don't have a body? Do they run on batteries?" or something like that.

[rogue06]

His question shows he is just acting stupid again.

Acting? Again? The latter presupposes that there are times he isn't "acting" stupid.

[Sparko]

Acting? Again? The latter presupposes that there are times he isn't "acting" stupid.

well I said this whole thread was him putting on an ignorant act to troll. But Teal said we should give him a chance and take him seriously. So I have been doing so (mostly) except his latest "question" about the body being a zombie without a spirit shows he is STILL doing his act (should have used "still" instead of "again")

[JimL]

I have no idea where you're getting this from.

I asked if the spirit doesn't die, then what is resurrected. You answered "the body." Now I get what you're saying though, resurrection isn't bringing anything back to life, it's just putting the decayed body back together so the spirit can climb back into it. correct.

More or less, though the resurrection of everyone will happen all at once, those still kicking around will meet them in the air, and everyone will be changed at once.

So you're saying that we do ascend, but not to heaven, just up into the clouds somewhere as a meeting place to be made incorruptible and then we come back down again to earth to live forever? Will god make earth incoruptible as well, because otherwise we'll eventually have to find somewhere else to live eternally?

[One Bad Pig]

I'm not sure what the Eastern Orthodox view on this is, but my view is that before Christ's death, Sheol contained both the righteous and wicked dead, which itself was divided between a place of comfort and discomfort (demonstrated in Jesus' parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man).

I think after Jesus died he went down into Sheol and brought out the righteous dead to be in his presence, where they remain in conscious repose until the general resurrection. The wicked dead, I think, probably stay in the same uncomfortable side of Sheol till the day of judgement.

More or less, yeah. If you look at an icon of the Dormition (falling asleep) of Mary, you'll see Jesus depicted behind/above the bier holding her soul in his arms. In the Orthodox view, there are two judgments, the particular and general(=white throne). The particular judgment happens after death, and involves examination of one's deeds in life. A significant number of Orthodox hold to the idea of Aerial Toll Houses which we pass through after death and at which our deeds in life are examined. It's not dogma, but it has a long history in the church.

[JimL]

well I said this whole thread was him putting on an ignorant act to troll. But Teal said we should give him a chance and take him seriously. So I have been doing so (mostly) except his latest "question" about the body being a zombie without a spirit shows he is STILL doing his act (should have used "still" instead of "again")

What else would you call a disemspirited resurrected body?