Black Lives Matter gets what they want, and it's not what they want

[carpedm9587]

What's even more sad, our Sheriff, recently deceased, once told me, with sadness, "I'm arresting the grandchildren of people I arrested 40 years ago".

So perhaps it is time to put an end to the cycle of violence, and the school-to-prison funnel? Americans jail more of their citizens than any other country, at 724 people per 100,000. Russia is 581 per 100,000 and the world average is 145 per 100,000.

Crime and violence are demonstrably linked to poverty. So instead of jailing everyone (which certainly keeps the prison-as-a-business industry happy), perhaps actually do something to address poverty?

I heard something on one of the many podcasts I listen to the other day that struck a chord. It went something like this (I'm paraphrasing):

Americans may be the victims of their own ideals. Most people in America believe in the "American Dream;" the notion that anyone with a will and the initiative can go from rags to riches. The negative side of that ideal is "anyone who has not gone from rags to riches has failed to do so because they lack the will and the initiative." As a consequence, Americans tend to see poor people as lazy, and undeserving of assistance. That cycle feeds on itself, condemning generation after generation to poverty, for no other reason than, if you're told you're poor because you're lazy often enough, you'll probably come to agree with it, or define yourself in those terms. Meanwhile, countries that have recognized that sometimes the poor need a leg up - a means to extricate themselves from poverty have significantly less poverty and, as a result, significantly less crime and significantly lower levels of incarceration.

I have the suspicion that will fall on deaf ears on this forum - but I have to admit it rang a bell when you look at the numbers across the various countries, and the evidence that poverty/crime/violence are inextricably linked. And then when you look at the widening gap between rich and poor in this country, and the continual erosion of any program designed to help the poor...

Round and round we go....and then we wonder why we keep seeing the same sights every time the merry-go-round makes another revolution...

[Cow Poke]

So perhaps it is time to put an end to the cycle of violence, and the school-to-prison funnel? Americans jail more of their citizens than any other country, at 724 people per 100,000. Russia is 581 per 100,000 and the world average is 145 per 100,000.

Crime and violence are demonstrably linked to poverty. So instead of jailing everyone (which certainly keeps the prison-as-a-business industry happy), perhaps actually do something to address poverty?

I heard something on one of the many podcasts I listen to the other day that struck a chord. It went something like this (I'm paraphrasing):

Americans may be the victims of their own ideals. Most people in America believe in the "American Dream;" the notion that anyone with a will and the initiative can go from rags to riches. The negative side of that ideal is "anyone who has not gone from rags to riches has failed to do so because they lack the will and the initiative." As a consequence, Americans tend to see poor people as lazy, and undeserving of assistance. That cycle feeds on itself, condemning generation after generation to poverty, for no other reason than, if you're told you're poor because you're lazy often enough, you'll probably come to agree with it, or define yourself in those terms. Meanwhile, countries that have recognized that sometimes the poor need a leg up - a means to extricate themselves from poverty have significantly less poverty and, as a result, significantly less crime and significantly lower levels of incarceration.

I have the suspicion that will fall on deaf ears on this forum - but I have to admit it rang a bell when you look at the numbers across the various countries, and the evidence that poverty/crime/violence are inextricably linked. And then when you look at the widening gap between rich and poor in this country, and the continual erosion of any program designed to help the poor...

Round and round we go....and then we wonder why we keep seeing the same sights every time the merry-go-round makes another revolution...

I am actively involved in breaking the cycle every day of my life, Carpe, and don't really need this 'sermon'.

[carpedm9587]

I am actively involved in breaking the cycle every day of my life, Carpe, and don't really need this 'sermon'.

I have no idea why you think it was targeted specifically to you, other than the fact that I replied to your post. It was a general observation for anyone reading. Perhaps the "you" was misleading. It was meant second-person plural. I should have said "ya'll" or "all of us."

But frankly, individual effort will not cut it for this. It's like an ant trying to clean a sports stadium. It might get a couple of leaves cleared away, but the stadium stays dirty. This will take a willingness to look at our institutions, identify the ones perpetuating poverty, and changing them.

And it will require a revisit of the "wealth redistribution" mantra from the right. When the richest 1% hold over 38% of all privately held wealth while the bottom 90% hold 73% of all debt; and when the richest 1 percent in the United States now own more wealth than the bottom 90 percent put together, poverty is not going to change until something is done to change those numbers. When a person cannot make a living wage with benefits when working a full-time job, something is very wrong. Eliminating poverty requires money to make the changes. That money has to come from somewhere.

[Cow Poke]

I have no idea why you think it was targeted specifically to you, other than the fact that I replied to your post.

[carpedm9587]

[Jedidiah]

So perhaps it is time to put an end to the cycle of violence, and the school-to-prison funnel? Americans jail more of their citizens than any other country, at 724 people per 100,000. Russia is 581 per 100,000 and the world average is 145 per 100,000.

Crime and violence are demonstrably linked to poverty. So instead of jailing everyone (which certainly keeps the prison-as-a-business industry happy), perhaps actually do something to address poverty?

I heard something on one of the many podcasts I listen to the other day that struck a chord. It went something like this (I'm paraphrasing):

Americans may be the victims of their own ideals. Most people in America believe in the "American Dream;" the notion that anyone with a will and the initiative can go from rags to riches. The negative side of that ideal is "anyone who has not gone from rags to riches has failed to do so because they lack the will and the initiative." As a consequence, Americans tend to see poor people as lazy, and undeserving of assistance. That cycle feeds on itself, condemning generation after generation to poverty, for no other reason than, if you're told you're poor because you're lazy often enough, you'll probably come to agree with it, or define yourself in those terms. Meanwhile, countries that have recognized that sometimes the poor need a leg up - a means to extricate themselves from poverty have significantly less poverty and, as a result, significantly less crime and significantly lower levels of incarceration.

I have the suspicion that will fall on deaf ears on this forum - but I have to admit it rang a bell when you look at the numbers across the various countries, and the evidence that poverty/crime/violence are inextricably linked. And then when you look at the widening gap between rich and poor in this country, and the continual erosion of any program designed to help the poor...

Round and round we go....and then we wonder why we keep seeing the same sights every time the merry-go-round makes another revolution...

In other words we need more nanny state. Bigger central government with more control of individual lives.

[Mountain Man]

What's even more sad, our Sheriff, recently deceased, once told me, with sadness, "I'm arresting the grandchildren of people I arrested 40 years ago".

That's what you get when "equality" means tearing down one segment of the population instead of building the other segment up.

[Cow Poke]

That's what you get when "equality" means tearing down one segment of the population instead of building the other segment up.

One of our black leaders laments that the problem of the cycle of doom in his community is the fact that there are not enough black leaders challenging young blacks to excel. He says this is a problem that "whitey can't fix". So, liberals get all in a blather about welfare and government "solutions", but the biggest problem seems to be the lack of black fathers staying with the children they produce.

I'll prepare now to be blasted.

[Mountain Man]

One of our black leaders laments that the problem of the cycle of doom in his community is the fact that there are not enough black leaders challenging young blacks to excel. He says this is a problem that "whitey can't fix". So, liberals get all in a blather about welfare and government "solutions", but the biggest problem seems to be the lack of black fathers staying with the children they produce.

I'll prepare now to be blasted.

There was a story about graffiti that said "Black Lives Matter". Someone else came along, crossed out "Lives" and wrote "Fathers". The liberal media decried it as racist of course.

[Cow Poke]

There was a story about graffiti that said "Black Lives Matter". Someone else came along, crossed out "Lives" and wrote "Fathers". The liberal media decried it as racist of course.

It doesn't fit the left's anti-family pro-gay agenda.

[carpedm9587]

It doesn't fit the left's anti-family pro-gay agenda.

I just came back from the funeral for my aunt, after which I had a chance to spend some time with my gay cousin, his partner (they are married) and their four beautiful children. When his eldest was diagnosed with a potentially fatal condition involving fluid drainage from his brain, they moved heaven and earth to ensure one of them was always with him, for 18 months as they worked to stabilize him. I watched him break down and cry over the stress it place on all of them, and the pain they went through wondering if their son was going to make it. I saw the love any father would have for a son - a love not unlike the love my wife and I showed when our own son was loosing his eyesight, and we had no clue what was causing it.

To then return to this kind of moronic comment - devoid of any knowledge of what "family" is truly about - and bent of dehumanizing and disenfranchising an entire group of people for no reason than they love someone with matching genitals. On this topic, the "moral right" is on the wrong side of morality - badly. Those who believe these this and express these sentiments harm and foster hatred with no regard for consequences.

I don't now whether to be angry...sad...or just pity you for your narrow-mindeness...

[Mountain Man]

As you said in another thread, even Hitler and Mussolini were capable of doing good, but that doesn't justify their wickedness.

[Starlight]

It doesn't fit the left's anti-family pro-gay agenda.

The left is "anti-family"?

Methinks you've been snorting too much cow poop or something.

Reminder: The US right are the ones who like to break up immigrant families by deporting parts of them, the US right are the ones who want to destroy same-sex families by prevent the parents marrying and preventing adoption rights, the US right are the ones who oppose family support policies like paid parental leave (which the US is almost the only country in the world not to have), the US right are the ones who think it's okay for parents to throw their gay teenage children out of the house to be homeless on the streets.

Don't project your right-wing anti-family goals onto the left. The left is pro-family.

[Cow Poke]

The left is "anti-family"?

As it has been historically defined in the US, yes. In your world, who knows?

[Starlight]

As it has been historically defined in the US, yes. In your world, who knows?

I consider it an example of US right-wing nuttery that they have historically applied the "pro-family" label to themselves when almost all their policies are anti-family.