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If you think this is the area where you tell everyone you are sorry for eating their lunch out of the fridge, it probably isn't the place for you


This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.


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  • #91
    Originally posted by lao tzu View Post
    MM has a physical disability that would make me mad at the world, not that I'm mentioning that as anything other than a possible example. But given that examples are possible, taking one step back isn't merely good ethics, it's good hermeneutics.
    Huh. News to me. IIRC he adopted a son who is deaf (which he does not characterize as a disability), but I don't recall him being disabled in any way.
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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    I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

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    • #92
      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
      I wasn't even looking for this.

      Meditation DOESN'T make you a calmer person: Buddhist practice leaves people just as aggressive and prejudiced, reveals study

      If every eight-year-old in the world is taught meditation, the world will be without violence within one generation,' the Dalai Lama claims.

      But it appears the respected monk could be wrong.

      For scientists have revealed the trendy Buddhist practice does not make you more compassionate, less aggressive or prejudiced.

      Meditation, incorporating a range of spiritual and religious beliefs, has been touted for decades as being able to make the world a better place.

      However, researchers from the UK, New Zealand and The Netherlands, have found meditation doesn't change how adults behave towards others.


      Us not fancy country folk call it "taking a nap"

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      • #93
        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
        I wasn't even looking for this.

        Meditation DOESN'T make you a calmer person: Buddhist practice leaves people just as aggressive and prejudiced, reveals study

        If every eight-year-old in the world is taught meditation, the world will be without violence within one generation,' the Dalai Lama claims.

        But it appears the respected monk could be wrong.

        For scientists have revealed the trendy Buddhist practice does not make you more compassionate, less aggressive or prejudiced.

        Meditation, incorporating a range of spiritual and religious beliefs, has been touted for decades as being able to make the world a better place.

        However, researchers from the UK, New Zealand and The Netherlands, have found meditation doesn't change how adults behave towards others.

        The same would apply to prayer, judging by the violence and aggression perpetrated by some religious people...of all religions. But in all instances, one can aspire to be a better person.
        “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

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        • #94
          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
          I wasn't even looking for this.

          Meditation DOESN'T make you a calmer person: Buddhist practice leaves people just as aggressive and prejudiced, reveals study

          If every eight-year-old in the world is taught meditation, the world will be without violence within one generation,' the Dalai Lama claims.

          But it appears the respected monk could be wrong.

          For scientists have revealed the trendy Buddhist practice does not make you more compassionate, less aggressive or prejudiced.

          Meditation, incorporating a range of spiritual and religious beliefs, has been touted for decades as being able to make the world a better place.

          However, researchers from the UK, New Zealand and The Netherlands, have found meditation doesn't change how adults behave towards others.


          Buddhists perform the same sort of evil actions that others do. No advantage there.
          Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

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          • #95
            Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
            Buddhists perform the same sort of evil actions that others do. No advantage there.
            Except in history Buddhists have performed far fewer evil actions as the Abrahamic religions. I am also acknowledging here that we are all fallible humans, and universally capable of evil actions.
            Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
            Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
            But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

            go with the flow the river knows . . .

            Frank

            I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

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            • #96
              Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
              Except in history Buddhists have performed far fewer evil actions as the Abrahamic religions. I am also acknowledging here that we are all fallible humans, and universally capable of evil actions.
              Of course, there are far FAR fewer Buddhists, so...
              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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              • #97
                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                Of course, there are far FAR fewer Buddhists, so...
                Not really relevant, because Buddhism has a longer history than Christianity, and ruled Kingdoms and the population is not small today nor in history.

                Source: https://www.google.com/search?q=buddhist+population+2017&oq=Buddhist+popu&aqs=chrome.2.0j69i57j0l4.14833j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8


                Buddhism is a religion practiced by an estimated 488 million in the world, 495 million, or 535 million people as of the 2010s, representing 9% to 10% of the world's total population. China is the country with the largest population of Buddhists, approximately 244 million or 18.2% of its total population.

                © Copyright Original Source

                Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                go with the flow the river knows . . .

                Frank

                I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                  Not really relevant
                  Yes it is.
                  The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Originally posted by JimL View Post
                    Ya think. Do you think you are directly communing with god when praying the rosary, repeating the same words over and over?
                    This is not a Protestant practice.
                    For Neo-Remonstration (Arminian/Remonstrant ruminations): <https://theremonstrant.blogspot.com>

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                    • This thread caught my eye. I suspect there are two things that underlay the phenomenon of "atheist prayer." One is the transitional period many atheist go through. I think CP's early comment about a "just in case" strategy may be quite apt for many in that state of their transition.

                      The second is the deep-seated reality of religion in our culture/society. When crisis hits, and it becomes clear that our personal resources are not (or may not be) adequate to avert the crisis, the last resort would be to appeal to a "higher force," in the hopes there might be one and it might respond. That aligns with the "atheists in foxholes" adage, and reflects the psychological reality of our survival instinct.

                      That this psychological reality exists does not seem, to me, to have an impact on the reality or non-reality of such a being actually existing. It says more about human psychology than theology.
                      The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                      I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

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                      • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                        Yes it is.
                        No it is not not, because there are not "few" Buddhists.
                        Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                        Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                        But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                        go with the flow the river knows . . .

                        Frank

                        I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by The Remonstrant View Post
                          This is not a Protestant practice.
                          Buddhists have their own rosary.
                          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                          go with the flow the river knows . . .

                          Frank

                          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                            No it is not not,
                            Is so!

                            because there are not "few" Buddhists.
                            So?
                            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                              Buddhists have their own rosary.
                              Hmmmm... didn't know that.
                              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by lao tzu View Post
                                ...

                                Now if Paul had said that, instead, I'd be a bit more sympathetic with his arguments, and their apologists. But no, he just had to call me a fool, and in doing so lost the opportunity to understand me, and, given that his words are preserved and accorded disproportionate weight, continue to act as a bar to understanding.

                                Mut. mut.
                                Um, the Psalmist got to it first.

                                Context matters. In this instance, neither the Psalmist nor Paul are talking about strong atheism - the actual literal disbelief in God's existence - they are both talking about deliberate self-deception - deciding not to believe in God's existence not due to evidence, but to preference.

                                Now, if you are deliberately disbelieving in the existence of God because you'd rather He didn't exist, you're being irrational and foolish. If your reasoning has led you to that conclusion on rational grounds, then you aren't being considered in either of the relevant parts of Scripture.

                                Scripture doesn't deal with strong atheism - it simply did not exist as a recognized school of thought anywhere in the ancient world. Sure, there were bound to be a few - but the vast majority of ancient thinking accepted the existence of God or gods as a given - their debates turned to the issues of His nature / their natures, et al.

                                Ya know, I agree with most of what you were saying (even if I'm not as good about it as I wish I were ) but I can't help but notice you did the exact same thing to Paul that you were chiding the others about.
                                "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

                                "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

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