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This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.


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  • #31
    IMG_0504.JPG

    --Justin Peters, in response to WoF bull.


    Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by JimLamebrain View Post
      Does he talk back, and if so, how do you know it's not you talking to yourself?
      We can't explain it to you, Jimmy, any more than we could explain what a sunset looks like to a man who has been blind since birth. I know when God is "speaking" to me. It doesn't happen often for me, but it's unmistakeable when it does. I won't bother to explain it to you any more than that because you wouldn't understand it if I tried. And, no, I'm not talking grand, earth-shattering revelations. It has always been personal in nature.

      This is a rational position for Christians to take because if it's true that God exists then he is certainly capable of influencing our actions and decisions in one way or another.
      Last edited by Mountain Man; 01-16-2018, 10:31 AM.
      Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
      But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
      Than a fool in the eyes of God


      From "Fools Gold" by Petra

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
        We can't explain it to you, Jimmy, any more than we could explain what a sunset looks like to a man who has been blind since birth. I know when God is "speaking" to me. It doesn't happen often for me, but it's unmistakeable when it does. I won't bother to explain it to you any more than that because you wouldn't understand it if I tried. And, no, I'm not talking grand, earth-shattering revelations. It has always been personal in nature.

        This is a rational position for Christians to take because if it's true that God exists then he is certainly capable of influencing our actions and decisions in one way or another.
        My best example of God speaking to me was when my oldest brother died. He was 27 and was eaten up with cancer. I had a really hard time knowing how to pray - do I pray for healing, knowing that I would have a terrible time mustering the faith required for that, knowing his condition?

        I went out on a fishing pier where he and I used to fish, and just sat and prayed earnestly for God to let me know how I should even pray.

        It came to me very clearly - not in a big booming audible voice, or even anything "external", but a total peace and an assurance that "I'm bringing him home". The "proof" for me that this was God, and not just my own "wishes", is that I wanted my brother to be healed, to live, but I felt such a warmth and peace knowing that he was "going home".

        And, yeah, there's no way to explain this to an unbeliever, especially one looking to mock Christianity.
        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
          My best example of God speaking to me was when my oldest brother died. He was 27 and was eaten up with cancer. I had a really hard time knowing how to pray - do I pray for healing, knowing that I would have a terrible time mustering the faith required for that, knowing his condition?

          I went out on a fishing pier where he and I used to fish, and just sat and prayed earnestly for God to let me know how I should even pray.

          It came to me very clearly - not in a big booming audible voice, or even anything "external", but a total peace and an assurance that "I'm bringing him home". The "proof" for me that this was God, and not just my own "wishes", is that I wanted my brother to be healed, to live, but I felt such a warmth and peace knowing that he was "going home".

          And, yeah, there's no way to explain this to an unbeliever, especially one looking to mock Christianity.
          I understand this perfectly, but I know Jimmy won't. He'll dismiss it as wishful thinking, or telling yourself what you want to hear (that your brother will ultimately be fine), but you and I know better.
          Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
          But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
          Than a fool in the eyes of God


          From "Fools Gold" by Petra

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
            We can't explain it to you, Jimmy, any more than we could explain what a sunset looks like to a man who has been blind since birth. I know when God is "speaking" to me. It doesn't happen often for me, but it's unmistakeable when it does. I won't bother to explain it to you any more than that because you wouldn't understand it if I tried. And, no, I'm not talking grand, earth-shattering revelations. It has always been personal in nature.

            This is a rational position for Christians to take because if it's true that God exists then he is certainly capable of influencing our actions and decisions in one way or another.
            Okay, so you know it's god, you just can't explain how you know it's god. That's not really a rational position for anyone to take MM, it is a position lacking reason. Children speak to their imaginary friends as well, and they think that their imaginary friends are talking back to them. But we adults all know that their friends are not real, that they are communicating with themselves. Sane adults do this as well, except that the person to whom they are communing is real, and they know it to be themselves.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by JimLamebrain View Post
              Okay, so you know it's god, you just can't explain how you know it's god.
              No, I said I can't explain it to YOU because you lack the requisite knowledge, understanding, and willingness necessary to comprehend the answer, and I'm not going to throw my pearls before a swine like you.
              Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
              But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
              Than a fool in the eyes of God


              From "Fools Gold" by Petra

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                No, I said I can't explain it to YOU because you lack the requisite knowledge, understanding, and willingness necessary to comprehend the answer, and I'm not going to throw my pearls before a swine like you.
                I have found that usually when someone says, I can't explain it, you wouldn't understand, it's a sign of their own lack of knowledge. Feyman always comes to mind, speaking about particle/wave duality, where he said, and I paraphrase of course, "if someone can't explain something in easily understood terms, then in all likelyhood it is because they really just don't know what they're talking about."

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by JimL View Post
                  I have found that usually when someone says, I can't explain it, you wouldn't understand, it's a sign of their own lack of knowledge. Feyman always comes to mind, speaking about particle/wave duality, where he said, and I paraphrase of course, "if someone can't explain something in easily understood terms, then in all likelyhood it is because they really just don't know what they're talking about."
                  In this case it just means you do not have eyes to see it.
                  Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by JimL View Post
                    Okay, so you know it's god, you just can't explain how you know it's god. That's not really a rational position for anyone to take MM, it is a position lacking reason. Children speak to their imaginary friends as well, and they think that their imaginary friends are talking back to them. But we adults all know that their friends are not real, that they are communicating with themselves. Sane adults do this as well, except that the person to whom they are communing is real, and they know it to be themselves.
                    Just to be clear, am I correct in inferring from this that you believe religious people to be insane?

                    I won't be offended, I promise. Just curious.
                    I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by JimL View Post
                      Does he talk back, and if so, how do you know it's not you talking to yourself?

                      He calls my cell phone.

                      god-cell-phone.jpg
                      Last edited by Sparko; 01-16-2018, 11:38 AM.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
                        In this case it just means you do not have eyes to see it.
                        Are you saying that you not only talk to god, but that you see him as well?

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Zymologist View Post
                          Just to be clear, am I correct in inferring from this that you believe religious people to be insane?

                          I won't be offended, I promise. Just curious.
                          Well, I'm not sure I'd go that far, I think that some of the things they say and believe are kind of on the insane side, but I'm not even sure that deep down they really believe those things even though they say they do. But no, in general I wouldn't say they were themselves insane. I guess i would say that they are for the most part sane people, who hold to some insane idea's.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by JimL View Post
                            Well, I'm not sure I'd go that far, I think that some of the things they say and believe are kind of on the insane side, but I'm not even sure that deep down they really believe those things even though they say they do. But no, in general I wouldn't say they were themselves insane. I guess i would say that they are for the most part sane people, who hold to some insane idea's.
                            What's more insane, praying to a God you believe exists, or praying to a God you assert doesn't exist?

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                              What's more insane, praying to a God you believe exists, or praying to a God you assert doesn't exist?
                              I would say it's crazier to pray to a god that you do believe exists, simply because you believe it to exist. Praying to a god you don't believe exists is a hope, or a "just in case" thing.

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by JimLamebrain View Post
                                I have found that usually when someone says, I can't explain it, you wouldn't understand, it's a sign of their own lack of knowledge. Feyman always comes to mind, speaking about particle/wave duality, where he said, and I paraphrase of course, "if someone can't explain something in easily understood terms, then in all likelyhood it is because they really just don't know what they're talking about."
                                Oh, you don't understand, I'm perfectly capable of explaining my experiences in simple language, but I just know from experience that atheists like you are incapable of understanding. They always try to satisfy themselves that my experiences have a natural explanation, or that I'm lying, which always makes me laugh, because I know what I've experienced.

                                For instance, if I describe it as a compelling inward force that I know without a doubt has an external source, the Christians here will nod their heads with understanding while you look on with mocking and dull-witted incredulity.

                                Cow Poke gave a very personal example. Did you understand it? Are you willing to entertain the premise that he could have had a genuine answer from God? I doubt it.
                                Last edited by Mountain Man; 01-16-2018, 02:00 PM.
                                Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                                But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                                Than a fool in the eyes of God


                                From "Fools Gold" by Petra

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