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Thread: Should God Appear To Me?

  1. #51
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    I already answered you on this same question several times, JimL. They go to hell because they are sinners and that is JUST. The 'unjust' part is that God has mercy on those who ask him for salvation and turn their lives over to him based on Jesus' sacrifice. The reason Jesus had to die was to satisfy that justice so that God could extend mercy on to any who ask. So that way God can remain just and the sins are punished but Jesus paid the punishment instead of me. The debt owed was paid. Your debt can be paid too if you just ask. But since you won't you will just pay it yourself and justice is done.

    Romans 10 talks about this very question of yours. You might want to read it. Heck read all of Romans. It lays everything out for you: mercy, justification, sanctification. Give it a try.

    Romans 10:8
    “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,” that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: 9If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved. 11As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.”12For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, 13for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

    14How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them? 15And how can anyone preach unless they are sent? As it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!”
    Right, so like I said, your god is unjust in that he has mercy on those who have heard of his existence and believe it, and not on those who have never heard of his existence nor believe it? So your god is unjust, right or wrong?

  2. #52
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    Right, so like I said, your god is unjust in that he has mercy on those who have heard of his existence and believe it, and not on those who have never heard of his existence nor believe it? So your god is unjust, right or wrong?
    He is just. That is why Jesus had to die for our sins.

  3. #53
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    He is just. That is why Jesus had to die for our sins.
    No, he apparently only died for the sins of those who have ever heard of him and believe in him. That's unjust , right?

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    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    No, he apparently only died for the sins of those who have ever heard of him and believe in him. That's unjust , right?
    No he died for your sins too. All you have to do is accept it. But you can't because you don't believe in God. It's all your fault.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    No he died for your sins too. All you have to do is accept it. But you can't because you don't believe in God. It's all your fault.
    Still avoiding the obvious I see, Sparko. There are billions of people who lived and had never heard of Jesus and so didn't believe in him, which, according to you, they all went to hell. Did Jesus die for their sins? Of course not. Now try answering to that instead of continuing to spew your illogical nonsense.

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    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    Still avoiding the obvious I see, Sparko. There are billions of people who lived and had never heard of Jesus and so didn't believe in him, which, according to you, they all went to hell. Did Jesus die for their sins? Of course not. Now try answering to that instead of continuing to spew your illogical nonsense.
    Yes Jesus died for everyone's sins and freely saves all who ask. and everyone who goes to hell does so because of their own sins. The reason you can't accept it is because you are damned. To you it all sounds foolish. But that's to be expected. If you had any sense you would believe and be saved. So instead God gives you over to your own delusion.

    1 Corinthians 1:18
    For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

    Romans 1:28
    Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    Yes Jesus died for everyone's sins and freely saves all who ask. and everyone who goes to hell does so because of their own sins. The reason you can't accept it is because you are damned. To you it all sounds foolish. But that's to be expected. If you had any sense you would believe and be saved. So instead God gives you over to your own delusion.

    1 Corinthians 1:18
    For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

    Romans 1:28
    Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done.
    Why, I wonder, don't you address my actual argument rather than repeating the same drivel over and over again. Are you having a problem comprehending my point? Here, I'll try once again. See if you can get it this time. "There have been millions of people who have lived and never even heard of your Jesus of 2000 years ago. Did Jesus die in order to save them or not?

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    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    Why, I wonder, don't you address my actual argument rather than repeating the same drivel over and over again. Are you having a problem comprehending my point? Here, I'll try once again. See if you can get it this time. "There have been millions of people who have lived and never even heard of your Jesus of 2000 years ago. Did Jesus die in order to save them or not?
    Romans 2 says:

    Romans 2:12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) 16 This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

  9. #59
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    Romans 2 says:

    Romans 2:12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) 16 This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
    Not answering the question Sparko. Did Jesus die in order to save those that never heard of him?

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    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    Not answering the question Sparko. Did Jesus die in order to save those that never heard of him?
    I answered you - read Romans. Jesus sacrifice covers the sin of mankind. All of mankind. It is applied only to those who ask him for salvation.

    Basically it is like a prepaid ticket waiting for you to ask for it at the box office. It is there for anyone who asks. But only those who do ask will get it. Anyone who doesn't will pay their own way even though there was a prepaid ticket just waiting for them if they wanted.

    In your case you do know about it yet you refuse to accept it. So rather than worry about the "millions who didn't know" you should worry about yourself because you will have no excuse.

  11. Amen Christianbookworm, RumTumTugger amen'd this post.

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