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Thread: Don't Call God "He..."

  1. #31
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    If you go to the Amazon page
    https://www.amazon.com/Inclusive-Bib.../dp/1580512135

    and click on "look inside" there are quite a number of pages you can read.
    Google books also has a preview https://books.google.com/books?id=Qr...page&q&f=false and
    https://books.google.com/books?id=Cw...page&q&f=false

    I'm always still in trouble again

  2. #32
    tWebber tabibito's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lee_merrill View Post
    And John specifically departs from Greek grammar rules in John 14:16 and elsewhere, using a masculine singular pronoun to refer to the neuter word for "Spirit".

    Blessings,
    Lee
    John 14:16 και εγω ερωτησω τον πατερα και αλλον παρακλητον δωσει υμιν ινα μενη μεθ υμων εις τον αιωνα. Byzantine Majority Text.

    Paraclete (the Holy Spirit as counsellor) is a masculine noun. ινα μενη does refer to the Holy Spirit though).
    16 κἀγὼ ἐρωτήσω τὸν πατέρα καὶ ἄλλον παρακλητον δώσει ὑμῖν, ἵνα μεθ’ ὑμῶν εἰς τὸν αἰῶνα ᾖ, 17 το πνευμα: UBS5
    Last edited by tabibito; 02-04-2018 at 05:09 AM.
    και εκζητησατε με και ευρησετε με οτι ζητησετε με εν ολη καρδία υμων

  3. #33
    tWebber tabibito's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by psstein View Post
    When I have the time, I'd love to see how badly they distort the original Hebrew and Greek.
    How long have you had these masochistic tendencies?
    και εκζητησατε με και ευρησετε με οτι ζητησετε με εν ολη καρδία υμων

  4. #34
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    The problem with using 'He' in the English language is that it can be and is commonly used in the gender neutral sense. Anal retentive grammarians, misguided theologians, and believers think the they can artificially change the meaning of the gender definition of God in traditional Christian theology by pronoun manipulation remains superficial and not meaningful.

    In the English translations of the Baha'i writings 'He' is used simply because or the English pronoun neutral definition, and it is understood that in the original Arabic and Persian languages all pronoun references to God are gender neutral, because God is considered without gender.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  5. #35
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shunyadragon View Post
    The problem with using 'He' in the English language is that it can be and is commonly used in the gender neutral sense. Anal retentive grammarians, misguided theologians, and believers think the they can artificially change the meaning of the gender definition of God in traditional Christian theology by pronoun manipulation remains superficial and not meaningful.

    In the English translations of the Baha'i writings 'He' is used simply because or the English pronoun neutral definition, and it is understood that in the original Arabic and Persian languages all pronoun references to God are gender neutral, because God is considered without gender.
    Then there's Jesus calling His Father, "Abba".

    In most Semitic languages, the word Abba (also rendered Ab or Aba) means "father" (or more affectionately "Papa" or "Daddy.") According to the Christian Gospels, Jesus used the word "Abba" when praying to God, which reflected a level of intimacy unheard of in the Old Testament era. Thus, we see in early Christian faith development what appears to be a deepening of human sensibility and relationship toward God, the Father, and the concomitant richer sensibility about God's representatives within the growing faith community.

    source

    1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

  6. Amen Cerebrum123 amen'd this post.
  7. #36
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    Then there's Jesus calling His Father, "Abba".

    In most Semitic languages, the word Abba (also rendered Ab or Aba) means "father" (or more affectionately "Papa" or "Daddy.") According to the Christian Gospels, Jesus used the word "Abba" when praying to God, which reflected a level of intimacy unheard of in the Old Testament era. Thus, we see in early Christian faith development what appears to be a deepening of human sensibility and relationship toward God, the Father, and the concomitant richer sensibility about God's representatives within the growing faith community.

    source
    As previously noted

    Quote Originally Posted by rogue06 View Post
    So we're supposed to just ignore the 150 to 160 times that Jesus refers to God as "father"? Including using the word "abba" which can be translated as "papa" or "daddy" a couple times?

    I'm always still in trouble again

  8. #37
    tWebber Psychic Missile's Avatar
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    Why would the Christian god consider himself male? If the only purpose is for ease of cultural assimilation, then wouldn't the identity of a male god be based on convenience rather than preference? In that case, for what reason should this identification be continued today?

  9. #38
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psychic Missile View Post
    Why would the Christian god consider himself male? If the only purpose is for ease of cultural assimilation, then wouldn't the identity of a male god be based on convenience rather than preference? In that case, for what reason should this identification be continued today?
    For what reason should it be changed? Just to add Him to all the other gender confusion in the world?

    1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

  10. #39
    tWebber Psychic Missile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    For what reason should it be changed? Just to add Him to all the other gender confusion in the world?
    If it's no longer necessary, I don't see the harm in changing it if. It may lead people to a better spiritual connection and it doesn't hurt your connection.

  11. #40
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psychic Missile View Post
    If it's no longer necessary, I don't see the harm in changing it if. It may lead people to a better spiritual connection and it doesn't hurt your connection.
    Yes, we should all get our theological positions from an atheist.

    1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

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