View Poll Results: How do you see voting

Voters
17. You may not vote on this poll
  • Voting is a right

    9 52.94%
  • Voting is a privilege

    6 35.29%
  • Voting is a responsibility

    13 76.47%
  • Voting is Something else (explain in thread)

    3 17.65%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: How Do You See Voting?

  1. #21
    tWebber carpedm9587's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvoUK View Post
    Not sure how I fit in with your liberaraian/authoritarian, progressive/conservative spectrum, but I view voting as a responsibility- and as a imperfect method of choosing those who govern our society.

    It relies on a well informed & politically engaged population (you can be both and hold differing views to me, naturally), and I also vehemently disagree with some forms of political donations. I do not believe that a politician/party ‘in the pocket’ of corporations/industry will have my, societies nor the environments best interests at heart.

    I also think that a two party system- such as you have in the US, but also to a lesser extent here in the UK due to a first past the post voting system- lessens the choice and therefore reduces voting to a ‘lesser of two evils’ exercise rather than allowing us to vote for a person/party who best represents our interests/views as we see them.
    I agree with that latter sentiment. New parties have no chance unless the U.S. shifts to an "instant run-off" model where people no longer feel they are "throwing away" their vote if they vote for alternative candidates as their primary choice. As candidates are eliminated, least popular to most, their secondary and even tertiary votes then are counted. But I don't think that is going to happen any time soon.
    The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.

    -Martin Luther King

  2. #22
    tWebber EvoUK's Avatar
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    Yes- with all due respect there does seem to be some kind of ancestor worship in the US with regards to the founding fathers and the constitution, which does seem to make the system less versatile. For example, the Trump presidency has highlighted several flaws in the system which although ‘traditional’, arent actually enforceable by law- his tax returns being one example.*

    I also realise the irony of my above statement coming from a country with a royal family.

    * I have no wish to deviate the thread into yet another Trump discussion

  3. #23
    tWebber carpedm9587's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvoUK View Post
    * I have no wish to deviate the thread into yet another Trump discussion
    I suspect that is inevitable...
    The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.

    -Martin Luther King

  4. #24
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    Voting is an interesting one because it is not an inherent or inalienable right -- after all, God doesn't run a democracy -- it's a "right" created by and solely dependent on the existence of some sort of governing body. If that governing body decides that people shouldn't vote, such as in a monarchy or a dictatorship, then you don't get to vote. It's as simple as that, and I really can't think of a universal argument for why people should be allowed to vote in every circumstance. In my own family, sometimes the parents will solicit the opinions of the children, other times the children must simply do as we say even if they have a different opinion. It depends on the situation.
    It's is a citizen's right. and it is a privilege, because it can be taken away (if you are no longer a citizen or are a felon), and it is a responsibility/duty because without voting our government couldn't work.

  5. #25
    Professor Zymologist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    I suspect that is inevitable...
    Yeah, he tends to trump most any discussion on politics.
    Hofstadter's Law: It will always take longer than you expect, even if you take into account Hofstadter's Law.

  6. #26
    tWebber carpedm9587's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    It's is a citizen's right. and it is a privilege, because it can be taken away (if you are no longer a citizen or are a felon), and it is a responsibility/duty because without voting our government couldn't work.
    It seems clear to me that the founders felt (and I agree) that a government SHOULD arise from the will of the governed, and that makes voting an intrinsic right. That claim also essentially says that other forms of government (e.g., dictatorships, monarchies) are ignoring a fundamental right and so are not truly valid forms of government - or perhaps ar elesser forms of government - because they intrinsically ignore this right.

    It also raises some serious questions about anything that could systemically compromise a citizen's right to vote.
    The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.

    -Martin Luther King

  7. #27
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    It seems clear to me that the founders felt (and I agree) that a government SHOULD arise from the will of the governed, and that makes voting an intrinsic right. That claim also essentially says that other forms of government (e.g., dictatorships, monarchies) are ignoring a fundamental right and so are not truly valid forms of government - or perhaps ar elesser forms of government - because they intrinsically ignore this right.

    It also raises some serious questions about anything that could systemically compromise a citizen's right to vote.
    I think with felons, the idea is that the person has shown that he does not wish to be part of our civilized society so he should not have the means to influence it. Some states will reinstate the right to vote after so many years or after the sentence is complete.

  8. #28
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    I'm listening to a podcast, which is talking about perceptions of voting in the U.S. The speaker is talking about differences between how voting is perceived by political parties and position on the political spectrum (i.e., liberaraian/authoritarian, progressive/conservative). They are noting that some people see voting as a right, some as a privilege, and some as a responsibility.

    It made me curious to hear what people here think. I don't know how tod o a poll, so I thought I'd just start this thread for people to post their views and (hopefully) why they think that way. Note, it does not have to be either/or. It is possible some will see voting as some combination of the above, or even as something else.
    It's a right as well as a responsibility.

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" -- starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)

  9. #29
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    You didn't. I just saw some posts about voting in other contexts and wanted to make sure the voting-related discussion (and especially the poll) stayed focus on the act of voting as a citizen. Other tangential issues are more than welcome.

    Sooner or later, we all know we'll end up discussing CP's grammar/spelling Nazi tendencies...
    This thread IS about me!

    1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

  10. Amen ke7ejx amen'd this post.
  11. #30
    tWebber carpedm9587's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    This thread IS about me!
    Hush, child! Your elders are talking...
    The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.

    -Martin Luther King

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