Announcement

Collapse

Civics 101 Guidelines

Want to argue about politics? Healthcare reform? Taxes? Governments? You've come to the right place!

Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
See more
See less

Florida School Shooting

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
    What does that matter? Your argument is that people who want drugs will find a way to get them, right? All laws do is make law abiding citizens non-law abiding citizens.
    I don't support hard drug legalization, i should've mentioned it earlier (no idea where you got that from). Although I would go about the drug war very differently.

    And no, laws can just deter someone from doing what they were previously doing. In this case they will deter someone from buying a gun for self defense and encourage criminal organizations to get into the now much more profitable gunrunning business.
    "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

    There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
      Harder for everyone.
      No. The gangs would shift the burden that you think would fall onto them on others.
      "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

      There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
        You've stated previously that you're for the illegalization of hard drugs. Wouldn't that mean that you believe that illegalization is somewhat effective? If not, then why do you think they should be illegal?
        I'm for the prohibition of drugs more out of moral conscience than a belief that any such policy is practical and effective. Casual marijuana use is illegal in my state, but that hasn't stopped several of my coworkers from regularly using it. Any honest law enforcement official will tell you that the war on drugs has effectively been lost even though we continue to fight it.

        The difference with guns, however, is that by making it easier for law abiding citizens to arm themselves, we can even the odds and beat the criminals at their own game.
        Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
        But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
        Than a fool in the eyes of God


        From "Fools Gold" by Petra

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
          Well...no. They won't. If there are no guns because of a gun ban, then they can't get guns, at least, not easily, and not cheaply.
          And yet they will. There are literally millions of them already out there - criminals can just swap them and sell them to each other. And just like drugs, it is pretty easy to smuggle in guns from Mexico and South America. Heck, easier. Dogs probably can't smell guns. And like someone else said, with 3D printers, you can pretty much print up as many guns as you want.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
            Here you are,

            https://www.cityofchicago.org/conten...er/GTR2017.pdf

            "With consistent data trends now going back almost a decade, the majority of illegally used or possessed firearms recovered in Chicago are traced back to states with less regulation over firearms, such as Indiana and Mississippi: More than two of every five traceable crime guns recovered in Chicago originate with their first point of sale at an Illinois dealer. The remaining 60 percent of firearms come from out of state, with Indiana as the primary source for approximately one out of every five crime guns."
            http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...l=1#post521916
            Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
              You've stated previously that you're for the illegalization of hard drugs. Wouldn't that mean that you believe that illegalization is somewhat effective? If not, then why do you think they should be illegal?
              Here is the difference:

              You are not going to stop drug use by making them illegal, but at least in the case of drugs you will be protecting those who do obey the law and will stay away from illegal drugs. You protect law abiding citizens from them. You won't stop criminals. In the case of guns, you don't want to stop law abiding citizens from having guns, you want to prevent the criminals from having them. You won't.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                No, what I'm saying is that your theory of economics only works when everybody agrees to play by the rules, which criminals most certainly don't.
                That theory of economics is dependent upon supply and demand--those are the only rules that matter.

                Abolishing guns could very well spur a thriving black market like it did for drugs where our law-enforcement agencies have to spend considerable resources in an almost futile attempt to keep it in check, and yet people have still made fortunes dealing illegal drugs.
                True, they might spur a thriving black market, and criminals might still make a fortune dealing illegal guns. That doesn't mean that the guns will be just as easy to get.
                "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                Save me, save me"

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                  And yet they will. There are literally millions of them already out there - criminals can just swap them and sell them to each other. And just like drugs, it is pretty easy to smuggle in guns from Mexico and South America. Heck, easier. Dogs probably can't smell guns. And like someone else said, with 3D printers, you can pretty much print up as many guns as you want.
                  I don't think it would be nearly as easy as you think. I believe that if, say, a woman wanted to kill her husband while a gun ban was enacted, it would be relatively complicated and expensive for her to find an illegal gun smuggler to sell her a weapon. Not nearly as easy, I don't believe, as going to one's local Walmart and purchasing said gun from there. But I repeat myself, as I've already made this point a few times. If you sincerely think it would be as easy or easier than going to Walmart, then I don't know what more to say. We disagree fundamentally.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by guacamole View Post
                    The point there being that if guns were harder to get across the United States, it might help reduce gun crimes.
                    This reveals what I have said more than once. Gun grabbers want to oppress law abiding citizens because it MIGHT help. But it might create a new illegal industry like the drug industry.
                    Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                      I don't think it would be nearly as easy as you think. I believe that if, say, a woman wanted to kill her husband while a gun ban was enacted, it would be relatively complicated and expensive for her to find an illegal gun smuggler to sell her a weapon. Not nearly as easy, I don't believe, as going to one's local Walmart and purchasing said gun from there. But I repeat myself, as I've already made this point a few times. If you sincerely think it would be as easy or easier than going to Walmart, then I don't know what more to say. We disagree fundamentally.
                      Sure you will prevent some crimes like that, where a normally law-abiding citizen wants to get a gun and doesn't have the means. But you will also be disarming a lot of law-abiding citizens who will be at the mercy of career criminals who don't go to walmart to buy their guns.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                        I don't think it would be nearly as easy as you think. I believe that if, say, a woman wanted to kill her husband while a gun ban was enacted, it would be relatively complicated and expensive for her to find an illegal gun smuggler to sell her a weapon. Not nearly as easy, I don't believe, as going to one's local Walmart and purchasing said gun from there. But I repeat myself, as I've already made this point a few times. If you sincerely think it would be as easy or easier than going to Walmart, then I don't know what more to say. We disagree fundamentally.
                        it would be easier and safer to poison him even if guns are available. in fact using guns for premeditated murder is a great way to get caught easily
                        "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                        There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
                          This reveals what I have said more than once. Gun grabbers want to oppress law abiding citizens because it MIGHT help. But it MIGHT create a new illegal industry like the drug industry.
                          Emphasis mine.
                          "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                          Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                          Save me, save me"

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                            Sure you will prevent some crimes like that, where a normally law-abiding citizen wants to get a gun and doesn't have the means. But you will also be disarming a lot of law-abiding citizens who will be at the mercy of career criminals who don't go to walmart to buy their guns.
                            gun grabbers simply refuse to acknowledge that their policy could have any negative consequences, let alone that those consequences could outweigh the benefits. It's why any conversation on the topic is inevitably low value.
                            "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                            There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by guacamole View Post
                              Emphasis mine.
                              jed was just being extra cautious, there is no might. it's a guarantee.
                              "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                              There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                                jed was just being extra cautious, there is no might. it's a guarantee.
                                Maybe let Jed speak for Jed.
                                "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                                Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                                Save me, save me"

                                Comment

                                Related Threads

                                Collapse

                                Topics Statistics Last Post
                                Started by little_monkey, Yesterday, 04:19 PM
                                16 responses
                                152 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post One Bad Pig  
                                Started by whag, 03-26-2024, 04:38 PM
                                53 responses
                                399 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Mountain Man  
                                Started by rogue06, 03-26-2024, 11:45 AM
                                25 responses
                                114 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post rogue06
                                by rogue06
                                 
                                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-26-2024, 09:21 AM
                                33 responses
                                198 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Roy
                                by Roy
                                 
                                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-26-2024, 08:34 AM
                                84 responses
                                373 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post JimL
                                by JimL
                                 
                                Working...
                                X