Page 1 of 52 1231151 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 511

Thread: Which Would You Personally Prefer...

  1. #1
    tWebber seer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    New England
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    21,796
    Amen (Given)
    1284
    Amen (Received)
    4399

    Which Would You Personally Prefer...

    1. To be created by amoral, non-rational forces of nature, or...

    2. To be created by a rational, morally good Being?

    I'm not asking if you believe or not in a god, but which scenario would you prefer, and perhaps why...
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

  2. Amen element771 amen'd this post.
  3. #2
    tWebber TheWall's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    3,245
    Amen (Given)
    1390
    Amen (Received)
    1564
    2.
    One would make it impossible for me to trust my own thoughts.

  4. Amen Rushing Jaws amen'd this post.
  5. #3
    tWebber seer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    New England
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    21,796
    Amen (Given)
    1284
    Amen (Received)
    4399
    Quote Originally Posted by TheWall View Post
    2.
    One would make it impossible for me to trust my own thoughts.
    That is what CS Lewis says: Supposing there was no intelligence behind the universe, no creative mind. In that case, nobody designed my brain for the purpose of thinking. It is merely that when the atoms inside my skull happen, for physical or chemical reasons, to arrange themselves in a certain way, this gives me, as a by-product, the sensation I call thought. But, if so, how can I trust my own thinking to be true? It's like upsetting a milk jug and hoping that the way it splashes itself will give you a map of London. But if I can't trust my own thinking, of course I can't trust the arguments leading to Atheism, and therefore have no reason to be an Atheist, or anything else. Unless I believe in God, I cannot believe in thought: so I can never use thought to disbelieve in God.
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

  6. Amen TheWall, lee_merrill, Rushing Jaws amen'd this post.
  7. #4
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    42,946
    Amen (Given)
    4033
    Amen (Received)
    19584
    I think a lot of people would say #1 because otherwise they are morally responsible for their actions to their creator.

  8. Amen Jedidiah amen'd this post.
  9. #5
    tWebber seer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    New England
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    21,796
    Amen (Given)
    1284
    Amen (Received)
    4399
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    I think a lot of people would say #1 because otherwise they are morally responsible for their actions to their creator.
    I wonder, following what Wall said - if they would generally trust their reasoning abilities more if they were created by a rational Being rather than non-rational forces?
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

  10. #6
    tWebber
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    805
    Amen (Given)
    244
    Amen (Received)
    264
    I am going to go with 2 as well (not surprisingly).

    In my mind, I don't believe that creation can just be an accident. To me that just doesn't make any sense at all.

  11. Amen seer, Raphael, Christianbookworm amen'd this post.
  12. #7
    tWebber Magenta's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Female
    Posts
    108
    Amen (Given)
    164
    Amen (Received)
    58
    Number 2 for me. I like order.

  13. Amen seer amen'd this post.
  14. #8
    Professor KingsGambit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Next to you
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    9,226
    Amen (Given)
    1490
    Amen (Received)
    3966
    2, because I could not imagine coming to terms with ultimate mortality under 1. It is well noted that Woody Allen and Larry King, both atheists, have opened up about being terrified of death.

    I don't get the point of the question, though. Personal preferences have no bearing on what is true.
    Last edited by KingsGambit; 03-07-2018 at 04:41 PM.
    For what was given to everyone for the use of all, you have taken for your exclusive use. The earth belongs not to the rich, but to everyone. - Ambrose, 4th century AD

    All cruelty springs from weakness. - Seneca the Younger

  15. Amen JimL amen'd this post.
  16. #9
    tWebber Starlight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    New Zealand
    Faith
    Atheist
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    8,168
    Amen (Given)
    2644
    Amen (Received)
    1595
    Number 2 is obviously preferable. It opens up the pleasant possibility of a nice afterlife.

    Sadly the God of the bible is morally atrocious (hell, genocides, etc) and so obviously doesn't fit #2. He's #3:
    3. To be created by an irrational, vengeful, unjust being.

    Number 1 is probably preferable in general to #3, but #2 is preferable to #1.

  17. Amen Charles amen'd this post.
  18. #10
    tWebber Starlight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    New Zealand
    Faith
    Atheist
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    8,168
    Amen (Given)
    2644
    Amen (Received)
    1595
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    I think a lot of people would say #1 because otherwise they are morally responsible for their actions to their creator.
    I have never in my life heard that view put forward by any atheist. I see zero reason to believe that anyone actually thinks like that and I think you're just making up a completely silly idea.


    Quote Originally Posted by TheWall View Post
    One would make it impossible for me to trust my own thoughts.
    You often seem to have strange views, so I'd generally recommend against trusting your thoughts.

    I have to say I've neither thought this argument was convincing in the slightest. Obviously beings capable of accurate thinking have an evolutionary advantage over beings not capable of it, so evolution inherently favors it. An intelligent creator, on the other hand, could decide to create rational beings, or irrational beings, or anything in between, depending on his whims, and so is zero guarantee our thoughts or our world would be rational. So, if anything, the argument works the other way - an intelligent creator being is capable of intentionally deceiving us, whereas the process of evolution isn't going to set out to intentionally deceive us.

  19. Amen Charles, JimL amen'd this post.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •