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Thread: Mark 14:12

  1. #11
    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faber View Post
    I don't know of any justification. It's only tradition. Personally, I don't see how it could be. Too many things happened in so short a time. The generally held conclusion is that the trial, which was for capital offense, was held quickly, despite the requirement for a two-day trial for capital cases. Consider this:

    If we hold to the traditional Thursday night Last Supper and arrest of Jesus, then this is the order in which the events on Friday morning took place:
    ∙ Early in the morning, after the morning Tamid sacrifice, the Sanhedrin took counsel to deliver Jesus to Pilate. The Tamid ceremony began at sunrise and lasted an hour. The Sanhedrin would have conveded around 7 AM local time, or an hour after sunrise.

    The witnesses were thoroughly vetted by the lawyers. They had to be in perfect agreement, even down to the smallest details. In order to do that, the lawyers asked a barrage of questions.
    The first set of questions known as the Hakiroth, were of a general nature. There were seven questions: During which set of seven years (a sabbatical week) was the crime committed? Which year of that week? Which month of that year? Which date of that month? What day of the week? What hour? At what place? The second set of questions, known as Bedikoth, were more intensive: In the case of Jesus, the witnesses could have been asked what He said, what He did. What exactly did He teach that was blasphemous? What specific act did He do in violation of the Sabbath? The witnesses were not questioned in the presence of other witnesses, lest there be any collusion. If the witnesses could not remember, or if they disagreed on any of the questions, their testimony was dismissed. And the lawyers considered themselves praiseworthy if they had a reputation for exhaustive cross-examination. The witnesses were asked if they knew the person, and if they gave him warning. (Tractate Sanhedrin; folio 40a)

    ∙ Early in the morning, Jesus was taken to the Hall of Judgment to be tried by Pilate. The Jews addressed Pilate outside the Hall of Judgment because they felt that entering the chambers of a gentile would disqualify them from observing the Passover.
    ∙ Pilate questioned Jesus inside the Hall of Judgment; found no fault in Jesus.
    ∙ Pilate returned to the Sanhedrin outside the Hall of Judgment. Pilate learned that Jesus was from Galilee, sent Jesus clear acros town to Herod Antipas in Herod's Palace.
    ∙ Herod Antipas questioned Jesus; chief priests accused Him before Herod. Herod’s guards mocked Jesus; Jesus was sent back across town to Pilate in the Fortress Antonia.
    ∙ Pilate summoned the rulers, offered to release Jesus; They wanted Barabbas released instead. They demanded that Jesus be crucified. Pilate submitted to their demand.
    ∙ Jesus was scourged, then taken to the Praetorium where He was mocked by the Roman soldiers.
    ∙ Either Jesus or Simon of Cyrene was forced to carry Jesus’s cross. Tradition states that Simon was forced to drag the cross after Jesus was no longer able. Not knowing the place of origin, and debating the actual location of Calvary (Kranion, or Golgotha), we can only estimate that somebody dragged a three-hundred-pound cross for the length of one or two thousand feet. The soldiers took Him to Golgotha, outside the gates of the city.
    ∙ Jesus spoke to the lamenting women.
    ∙ At the third hour (9 AM) Jesus was crucified. (Mark 15:25)
    All this in only two hours???
    There are some number of issues. I intended to have Mark 14:12 addressed.

    The evidence seems to point to what would then be a popular myth - that Christ had to be crucified on the 14th of the month. The following day from Mark 14:12 being interpreted as the 14th would make that day the 13th.

    Hebrews 10:1 explains, ". . . For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. . . ."
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  2. #12
    tWebber Faber's Avatar
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    While I may question the date of the Last Supper and the arrest of Jesus, I agree with the majority that Jesus was crucified on the 14th of Nisan, the day before the Passover feast as observed by the priests and the Pharisees. Even the Babylonian Talmud, the holiest of Hebrew writings, even higher than the Old Testament, agrees:

    On the eve of the Passover Yeshu was hanged. (tractate Sanhedrin, folio 43a)
    Some manuscripts of tractate Sanhedrin contain slight variations. Some read, “On the eve of Passover they hanged Yeshu ha-Notzri ( Jesus the Nazarene)” or “On Sabbath even and the eve of Passover they hanged Yeshu ha-Notzri.”

    It's only trolls like rstrats who insist that Jesus was buried for three whole days and three whole nights. Granted Matthew 12:40 presents some difficulty, but the references to Jesus rising on the third day are clear. If Jesus was crucified on Friday during the day, Sunday morning qualifies as being the third day.

  3. #13
    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    The Passover has 8 evenings. One for the passover day and seven of the Passover feast (see Luke 22:1 the feast being called the Passover).
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  4. #14
    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    The fact remains that Mark 14:12 biblically only refers to the 14th of that month. The 13th is an unbiblical invention to supposedly allow a 14th crucifixion. Biblically the Passover sin offering is on the 15th.
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  5. #15
    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    The date of what is spoken of in Mark 14:12 was the day before Christ was crucified.

    In 30AD it was April 5, a Wednesday.
    In 33AD it was April 3, a Friday.
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  6. #16
    tWebber Rushing Jaws's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 37818 View Post
    The date of what is spoken of in Mark 14:12 was the day before Christ was crucified.

    In 30AD it was April 5, a Wednesday.
    In 33AD it was April 3, a Friday.
    Another year that has been suggested is 29 AD. Which is perhaps influenced by how old one thinks He was when crucified. The dating of His Birth depends on what one thinks of the historicity of the Nativity accounts. And thanks to St John, there is some uncertainty as to how old He was during His Ministry.

    There is also the question: how far is the chronology of the Passion a theological construction rather than an historically reliable record ? And is one or more Gospels more historically reliable than others ? And if so - which ?

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