Originally posted by carpedm9587
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Marlon Bundo
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"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot
"Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman
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Originally posted by Charles View PostCan God Be Good Without Us?
And if there is a God (which I am yet to see you prove) it seems to follow that since human beings do not have value in and of themselves their value is based on the fact that God loves them and if he did not then torturing babies, killing and so on would be ok. Just like a lot of Christians find Hell to be just, because they don't care for humans but for what what God says. We find ourselves among the roots of religious extremism in this case only with the difference that luckily and by sheer accident, Christians do not go as far as ISIL or other with the same basic assumptions about God's role in moral philosophy (if you can even call it philosophy).
You're grossly over simplifying and misconstruing Christian theology."He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot
"Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman
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Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post...
His 24-year old "kid" is a young adult doing something good (a children's book with proceeds going to charity. Oliver & Co. took the opportunity to make a statement about something I consider equally good, and are also donating the proceeds to charity. Although the book is about Marlon Bundo, the parody is about Pence. It is one I happen to agree with. It is also (apparently) a well-written children's book (Oliver had it partly read/animated on his show). I am in support.
And really don't compare that kind of cheap tactic to Gandhi or King. Both of them had their flaws but fighting trashy wasn't among them."He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot
"Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman
My Personal Blog
My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)
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Originally posted by Teallaura View PostYou lose your rationale at Step Two - it is true that our value derives from Him - from His image in us, actually - but it's untrue that there are those He does not value. That His laws forbid murder, theft, adultery and the like is compelling evidence.
You're grossly over simplifying and misconstruing Christian theology.
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Originally posted by Charles View PostOr you are misconstructing my point? I have never said there are those god does not value. I have said that given the premisses presented it seems rather accidental and thus could be different. My points are in line with those of the Christian philosopher Leibniz. I wrote about it in much more detail in this thread in case you have not already seen it: http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...tion-of-ethics"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot
"Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman
My Personal Blog
My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)
Quill Sword
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Originally posted by carpedm9587 View PostSure, Seer. That's exactly what it means...Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by Teallaura View PostI did misread you on the first point (first sentence only) - apologies for that. The second is still a misconstruction and over simplification of Christian theology no matter who you attribute it to.
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Originally posted by Charles View PostAnything written in such a few lines is a simplification. You should go and read the much more detailed version if you take interest. You may find that the ideas you hold against my view are simplifications too."He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot
"Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman
My Personal Blog
My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)
Quill Sword
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Originally posted by Teallaura View PostI called it an over simplification, not a mere simplification. If you can't explain your view well enough to support the point then there's no real reason to suppose that it actually supports the point. My objection was to the point you were trying to make - that's not a world view challenge - it is a complaint about how you treated my worldview but only incidentally to the fact that it doesn't support your point because it isn't a correct representation of the theology.
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Originally posted by Charles View PostI can easily explain it and have done so several times which is why you should read my post on it if you take interest in anything else than complaining about something short being short without wanting to read the longer version: http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...tion-of-ethics"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot
"Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman
My Personal Blog
My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)
Quill Sword
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Originally posted by Teallaura View PostYou attacked the analogy instead of addressing the issue - it's a common tactic for you when you don't like the implications or where the argument may lead. Deflection really doesn't fool anyone, especially if it becomes habitual.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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Originally posted by Teallaura View PostYup, actually - your 'morality is only individual' thesis is just repackaged relativism.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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Originally posted by Teallaura View Post14 or 54 - she isn't the VP - if you (general) want to attack the VP then have the decency and the guts to take him on directly, not by undercutting the charitable work his daughter is doing - which is EXACTLY what that parody does.
And really don't compare that kind of cheap tactic to Gandhi or King. Both of them had their flaws but fighting trashy wasn't among them.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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Originally posted by seer View PostOf course Carp, that whole argument is inconsistent. We were discussing what was morally "ahead" or "behind." And you said that what was morally "ahead" was that which conforms to moral trends, like the trend to accept homosexual behavior. Then you turn around and talked about how you bucked social mores and trends. So you don't really buy into your own stated standard.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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Originally posted by carpedm9587 View PostThen you are not reading what I am writing. I am fairly clear on where I stand and why. But you certainly won't be the first here to accuse me of being disengenous. There's a handful of you that seem to do it on a fairly regular basis - usually when I say/post something you take exception to.Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist
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