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Have We Overspiritualized The Christian Walk?

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  • Have We Overspiritualized The Christian Walk?

    Are we being real?

    The text can be found here.

    ----

    Is there a danger to putting our best foot forward? Let's plunge into the Deeper Waters and find out.

    This is the kind of post that is really hard to write. It's because I know there are some readers who will be shocked to realize some things about me, but I hope that if they do, it will bring them comfort. I know I am an answer man to many, but there are many times that I have my own struggles and those are often with the Christian walk.

    Sometimes I think we overdo how it is. I know many people who have rich and vibrant prayer lives. I don't deny that for a moment. For me, this is an honest struggle. I have a very hard time with prayer. It could be because of my Aspergers. It's hard enough to talk to a person. Make that person divine and in fact a being who is tri-personal and it becomes even more difficult. I more often do minute prayers than long extended prayer times. I find it hard to know what it means to wrestle in prayer for someone. If that's you, excellent. Not knocking you. I am better at brief prayers throughout the day.*

    Sometimes I see Christians talking about their Bible study and how awesome it is every day. God just shows them something new that they hadn't seen before. If that's you, excellent, but I wonder if I'm more like other Christians want to admit. Sometimes, you're just reading the text. You don't get anything immediately. Maybe you can make a connection. Honestly, I seem to get more just doing my nightly Bible reading with my wife. I read it out loud for us together and sometimes I do get things that way.*

    Church services can be outright boring to me. I've grown tired of preachers who just give a text and jump straight to an application and Christianity is all about just being a good person. This doesn't even get to the music. The music part to me seems more like a concert. I don't really relate and I can't remember the last time I sang along. It's all too awkward for me.*

    Sometimes I think we put forward a position where we shouldn't struggle in the church and our lives are full of joy abundantly. Excuse me, but I know I'm rarely at that level. Many times when I am in a crisis, I find it hard to follow James and count all things joy. If anything, I can find myself lashing out at God and accusing Him and asking Him if He remembers His promises or if He even cares about the suffering going on.

    Yet when I read the Psalms, I wonder if I'm not the odd one out. The Psalmists seemed to do that a lot. It's strange that the question the Psalmists normally had was not if the people remembered the covenant, but if God remembered it.

    We seem to have this attitude in the church that if we put forward an image of our lives being less than perfect, there's something wrong with us. We're not fooling anyone. Being a Christian doesn't mean you're free of struggles. Sometimes a good worship service shouldn't leave you feeling happy. It should leave you feeling miserable with the conviction of sin. (This doesn't deny that you could have happiness when you realize grace and forgiveness.)

    1 in 3 men are said to struggle with pornography in the church, yet how often at a church service do you hear guys sharing that with other guys? It's almost like we want to treat sin as if it's not really real. Our messages at church are more self-help and can be found in any episode of Dr. Phil more often. You won't get the Biblical text from him, but many times the messages are awfully similar.*

    Maybe also this idea of putting forth this image is damaging. It damages new Christians who think there's something wrong with them and it bewilders skeptics who think we don't take life seriously. Christianity is just a feel-good religion to them. I try to tell them sometimes being a good Christian will mean you feel miserable. You feel the evil in the world or you feel the weight of your own sin or anything else.*

    I fear we can present the Christian life as just one amazing experience after another. I doubt that's what it's really like for most people. On the other hand, some could say I am guilty of intellectualizing matters and focusing too much on that area. They could also be right. Could it be like in most other cases, moderation is what is needed? Maybe the middle ground.

    I conclude this wondering what your thoughts are. Maybe you're out there thinking you agree with me and there's too much show in our personal lives and very little grow. Maybe you think I'm way off base and want to tell why. Comments are always open. Let me know.

    In Christ,
    Nick Peters

  • #2
    I think you have a fair point. I often wonder why a sermon like this doesn't occur.

    The pastor walks onstage dressed as a clown and preaches that we are all in despair. We hide that despair with vanities as we want to avoid what life without ultimate significance means. We are like Kefka burning down the world saying our destruction is worthwhile yet aggravated that Terra will set out to stop us. The pastor would then hold up a mirror. We are the clowns. He then would keep his makeup and speak of another clown. The one who knows life has meaning in God. This clown is sad because he wants to tell the world and everyone laughs they think it is all a joke yet he is being serious.

    Why not use Screwtape or Raskolnikov? Why not use Narnia? I do not know. The same man who walked on water was rebuked by Christ. Still I will not despair. I have seen many good sermons.
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    • #3
      Mr peters I want to discuss this.
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      • #4
        Music is one reason I'm now Orthodox. I also pray significantly more since my conversion, since I don't have to make everything up as I go along. There is, of course, a potential in form prayers for just mumbling through them without thought, but the same can be said for worship - and I don't recall that ever being castigated as "vain repetition." I've also found going to confession to be an enormous help, even though it was one of my main barriers to conversion. I can be open with my priest about my struggles; I HAVE to be, in order for him to help me.
        Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

        Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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        I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

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        • #5
          Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
          Music is one reason I'm now Orthodox. I also pray significantly more since my conversion, since I don't have to make everything up as I go along. There is, of course, a potential in form prayers for just mumbling through them without thought, but the same can be said for worship - and I don't recall that ever being castigated as "vain repetition." I've also found going to confession to be an enormous help, even though it was one of my main barriers to conversion. I can be open with my priest about my struggles; I HAVE to be, in order for him to help me.
          Talk-and-rock services are a big reason I'm becoming Orthodox, as well (my chrismation will be in just a couple weeks at Pascha). Likewise, I always struggled pretty severely with prayer before delving into liturgical traditions. I will admit my prayer rule is not as regular as I would like it to be yet, but it's so much better than when I was a lower church Protestant.

          "Fire is catching. If we burn, you burn with us!"
          "I'm not going anywhere. I'm going to stay here and cause all kinds of trouble."
          Katniss Everdeen


          Christ our Passover has been sacrificed for us. Therefore let us keep the feast.

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          • #6
            I do agree that much appearance concern does show up in our church lives. Some is probably good since we do not want to mess worship with other sorts of Christian behaviour.
            Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
            Sometimes I think we overdo how it is. I know many people who have rich and vibrant prayer lives. I don't deny that for a moment. For me, this is an honest struggle. I have a very hard time with prayer. . . .
            I do not have a problem with prayer in and of myself. I just talk to God like I would to another person. Is He beyond anyone else I might talk to? No matter, He knows what I am about so no worry. My prayer life is not amazing or exciting, is serves my connection with Him. I am not an aspy, but I do lean that way.

            Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
            Sometimes I see Christians talking about their Bible study and how awesome it is every day. God just shows them something new that they hadn't seen before. If that's you, excellent, but I wonder if I'm more like other Christians want to admit. Sometimes, you're just reading the text. You don't get anything immediately. Maybe you can make a connection. Honestly, I seem to get more just doing my nightly Bible reading with my wife. I read it out loud for us together and sometimes I do get things that way.*
            My wife and I do not often pray or read together. That is not our nature. We do discuss what we learn, and yes often things that are new and we (or one of us)never saw before – not always. I used to have some quite amazing Bible studies. I would spend hours in intellectual oriented studies. But the intellectual approach did not let me down, I still grew and came to understand more and love more.

            Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
            Church services can be outright boring to me. I've grown tired of preachers who just give a text and jump straight to an application and Christianity is all about just being a good person. This doesn't even get to the music. The music part to me seems more like a concert. I don't really relate and I can't remember the last time I sang along. It's all too awkward for me.*
            I can see seeker oriented services as getting boring. You never learn anything but the same old same old. Our pastor does clear expository messages going through books of the Bible. He does occasionally do topical studies, but is careful to not pick a few verses to support a position. He always seems to go from scripture to his points. I left my previous church because of this and because of the music. My present church sings mostly hymns to a piano. I can not always sing along because my voice seems to represent the noise rather than the joyful end of “make a joyful noise.” And my voice often just quits on me. (I love the “talk and rock”description by the way.)

            Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
            Sometimes I think we put forward a position where we shouldn't struggle in the church and our lives are full of joy abundantly. Excuse me, but I know I'm rarely at that level. Many times when I am in a crisis, I find it hard to follow James and count all things joy. If anything, I can find myself lashing out at God and accusing Him and asking Him if He remembers His promises or if He even cares about the suffering going on.
            I think this is mostly a matter of realizing that Christian joy is not the same as happiness or glee. I think the word glad would better serve the real meaning of what we read as joy. Ask yourself the question, “In the middle of trial am I still glad to belong to the Lord?” If the answer is yes you are experiencing Biblical joy.

            Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
            Yet when I read the Psalms, I wonder if I'm not the odd one out. The Psalmists seemed to do that a lot. It's strange that the question the Psalmists normally had was not if the people remembered the covenant, but if God remembered it.
            It seems to me that we (Christians in general) often misread the Psalms in trying to point to a moment by moment happiness. On the contrary the Psalms are points on a roller coaster ride of David and the other psalmists.

            Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
            We seem to have this attitude in the church that if we put forward an image of our lives being less than perfect, there's something wrong with us. We're not fooling anyone. Being a Christian doesn't mean you're free of struggles. Sometimes a good worship service shouldn't leave you feeling happy. It should leave you feeling miserable with the conviction of sin. (This doesn't deny that you could have happiness when you realize grace and forgiveness.)
            It does no good to do what is essentially lying about our current state. On the other hand worship is not really the place to air all of our struggles. For me this is the (or one of the) value of small group studies. The group gets to be very much of a family oriented system where such struggles can be more appropriately aired.

            Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
            1 in 3 men are said to struggle with pornography in the church, yet how often at a church service do you hear guys sharing that with other guys? It's almost like we want to treat sin as if it's not really real. Our messages at church are more self-help and can be found in any episode of Dr. Phil more often. You won't get the Biblical text from him, but many times the messages are awfully similar.*
            I suspect the 1 in 3 figure comes from self reporting Believers, not necessarily from a body of“born again” believers, if I may use the born again term. I am sure porn is a problem, but it may well be over stated

            Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
            Maybe also this idea of putting forth this image is damaging. It damages new Christians who think there's something wrong with them and it bewilders skeptics who think we don't take life seriously. Christianity is just a feel-good religion to them. I try to tell them sometimes being a good Christian will mean you feel miserable. You feel the evil in the world or you feel the weight of your own sin or anything else.*

            I fear we can present the Christian life as just one amazing experience after another. I doubt that's what it's really like for most people. On the other hand, some could say I am guilty of intellectualizing matters and focusing too much on that area. They could also be right. Could it be like in most other cases, moderation is what is needed? Maybe the middle ground.
            I suspect this does sometimes leave new believers with a weaker ability to fight sin in their lives.

            A clue to my view of over-spiritualizing our daily walk. Make it more concrete. Our spiritual maturity is revealed in what we do. We should not be trying to put on an act of being spiritual.

            Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.The second is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.”
            In my mind the second shows us how to do the first. How do you show love for Almighty God? Show love to those around you, especially our brothers and sisters in the Lord.
            Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

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