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Do you defend Trump's infidelity?

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  • Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
    Trump claims to be a Christian, so yes, it is fair to hold him to the standard of what he claims.
    You want to treat him as Christian (hold him to standard of Christian), also as non-Christian at same time (saying he is not brother Christian).

    Be consistent!
    Remember that you are dust and to dust you shall return.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by demi-conservative View Post
      You want to treat him as Christian (hold him to standard of Christian), also as non-Christian at same time (saying he is not brother Christian).

      Be consistent!
      I am being perfectly consistent.
      "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

      Comment


      • Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
        I am being perfectly consistent.
        In fantasy world of head of yours, maybe.

        He is either brother or not, so treat him wholly like brother or not.
        Remember that you are dust and to dust you shall return.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by guacamole View Post
          Are you asserting we Christians don't have to use discernment?
          Discernment says though Trump is not Christian, he is punishment from God for progs, so we might as well enjoy show.
          Remember that you are dust and to dust you shall return.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
            Briefly operating under the fiction that a single vote is meaningful in any way, you could say that voting for neither decreases both percentages in a way that decreases a mandate.
            This past election and the 2000 election should quickly tell us that a president can be decided by a narrow vote. Of course, single votes make a large difference in local elections and those people affect our lives too.
            "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
            GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

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            • Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
              I'm part of a third party that's tearing itself apart right now
              Kind of like what the big ones are doing.

              I'm always still in trouble again

              "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
              "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
              "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Terraceth View Post
                Have you considered third parties?
                Yeah. I voted third party last time.
                "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                Save me, save me"

                Comment


                • Originally posted by guacamole View Post
                  You aren't party to every sin the person has ever committed; however, you are party to policies they enact and abuses they commit thereafter, whether or not you support those in particular or not--especially when, like Trump, they have broadcast their wickedness well in advance. Therefore, for me, character is a concern--because I do not want to be party to those problems. If I cannot trust a politician with comparatively lesser things-like fidelity to a spouse-then why should I trust other oaths, including the oath of office, that they might have made. Character was a concern for me with the Clintons, and it is likewise a concern for Trump.

                  Trump is nakedly immoral. This doesn't mean that he is some how more honest than the Clintons--or any other politician who has endeavored to keep their sin out of the public view. It's that he is brazen. I think he has been, and will continue to be, even less beholden to traditional morality and decency than the "average" politician.
                  I believe you are grossly mischaracterizing Trump, which is a whole other issue, but given your position as described here, I don't see how you can in good conscience vote for anybody for anything. No matter who you vote for, somebody else can come along and say, "But what about this moral failing?" and then what? I honestly don't know how you're not paralyzed with indecision every time you step into the voting booth.

                  I'm of the mind that if I vote for someone in good faith (and I have seen nothing that would make me think that Trump is committed to anything but doing what is in the traditional best for America) then whatever moral misadventures they have in office is entirely on them.
                  Last edited by Mountain Man; 04-24-2018, 12:04 PM.
                  Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                  But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                  Than a fool in the eyes of God


                  From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by guacamole View Post
                    Yeah. I voted third party last time.
                    Which one? I gave it some consideration, but Gary Johnson is a pot-addled goofball, and more importantly is pro-choice (as is the Libertarian Party in general). I don't recall what problems I had with McMullins and Castle.
                    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

                    Beige Federalist.

                    Nationalist Christian.

                    "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

                    Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

                    Proud member of the this space left blank community.

                    Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.

                    Justice for Ashli Babbitt!

                    Justice for Matthew Perna!

                    Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                      I believe you are grossly mischaracterizing Trump,
                      In what way?

                      which is a whole other issue, but given your position as described here, I don't see how you can in good conscience vote for anybody for anything. No matter who you vote for, somebody else can come along and say, "But what about this moral failing?" and then what? I honestly don't know how you're not paralyzed with indecision every time you step into the voting booth.
                      Not every politician seems to be of the same moral fiber as Trump. Some seem better. Some seem worse. I'm not asking for saints, simply reasonably honest people trying to do a reasonably honest job.

                      I'm of the mind that if I vote for someone in good faith (and I have seen nothing that would make me think that Trump is committed to anything but doing what is in the traditional best for America) then whatever moral misadventures they have in office is entirely on them.
                      I cannot accept that thinking for myself. The way I see it, if I know a person is a scoundrel, and yet I trust them anyway and they reward my trust with scandalous behavior, then it's on me.

                      fwiw,
                      guacamole
                      "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                      Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                      Save me, save me"

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
                        Which one? I gave it some consideration, but Gary Johnson is a pot-addled goofball, and more importantly is pro-choice (as is the Libertarian Party in general). I don't recall what problems I had with McMullins and Castle.
                        I voted for McMullin, as he seemed to be the person of the best character, without any gross lapses of character that I could see. While he is a Mormon, my issue with Romney from the previous election was the spiritual accommodation made by some Christians. Castle I hadn't heard of. For Johnson, I'm directly opposed to Libertarianism as a political philosophy having read far too much of Ayn Rand to be comfortable with it. Jill Stein is an anti-vax accommodating nutcase. It just happens to be one of my pet issues.

                        fwiw,
                        guacamole
                        "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                        Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                        Save me, save me"

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
                          This past election and the 2000 election should quickly tell us that a president can be decided by a narrow vote. Of course, single votes make a large difference in local elections and those people affect our lives too.
                          Right, that's why I said "mandate", not "victory". I'm not sure how relevant that concept is in present politics though.
                          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                            I'm part of a third party that's tearing itself apart right now
                            Hrm, what's going on?

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Terraceth View Post
                              Hrm, what's going on?
                              Honestly, I've been out of the loop since they shut down their Facebook discussion group out of some philosophical objection to its setup so I've only heard bits and pieces; little enough I couldn't confidently give a blow by blow account.
                              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by guacamole View Post
                                I'm not asking for saints, simply reasonably honest people trying to do a reasonably honest job. [...]. The way I see it, if I know a person is a scoundrel, and yet I trust them anyway and they reward my trust with scandalous behavior, then it's on me.
                                All other things being equal, we're on the same page. Our disagreement seems to primarily concern who we think it is acceptable to vote for. Your characterization of Trump is, in my opinion, ill-informed and mean-spirited, but I'm not going to judge you for it, and in the same spirit, I would caution you not to judge others simply because they disagree with your opinion. It's a nasty political trick to question someone's faithfulness to Christ because you think they voted for the "wrong" person.
                                Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                                But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                                Than a fool in the eyes of God


                                From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                                Comment

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