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  • Originally posted by Doug Shaver View Post
    What about because you, 37818, say it is true?
    What is the basis that I say a thing is true? One is by reason I personally know God. Now how is that? The gospel of grace. Where is the gospel of grace found? Now my saying so does not prove anything, except I seem to think I know. Now you need to take the steps you missed. 1) To falsify my claim. 2) To discover the truth for yourself.

    Hay, the texts at least makes the claims (such as Romans 8:16, 2 Corinthians 13;5 and 1 John 5:9-12, etc).
    . . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Tassmoron View Post
      So 1 = 3 and 3 = 1 at the same time.
      Yes, so long as you understand that it's "3x = 1y" and "1y = 3x". It would only be a logical contradiction if it was asserted that something was both A and not-A at the same time and in the same sense, which is not at all what the doctrine of the Trinity asserts, a point that you seem intent on missing in all of your pigheaded ignorance.
      Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
      But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
      Than a fool in the eyes of God


      From "Fools Gold" by Petra

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
        pigheaded
        Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

        Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
        sigpic
        I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

        Comment


        • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
          I can tell you, from the outside, they won't really tell someone trying to understand all that much, IMO.
          I'm not under the illusion you or any other atheist participating in this thread is genuinely trying to understand the doctrine of the Trinity.
          Last edited by Mountain Man; 05-21-2018, 11:36 AM.
          Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
          But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
          Than a fool in the eyes of God


          From "Fools Gold" by Petra

          Comment


          • The thing that bugs me about this thread--if I can express this right--isn't the fact that atheists are taking issue with the doctrine of the Trinity (no surprise there), and it isn't even that they're taking issue with the analogies (I've never like any of the analogies, even the ones that aren't overtly heretical), but the insistence on terminology that Christians never use to try to demonstrate a contradiction. That's the very definition of a strawman.

            I mean, I get that you don't buy it. Just quit with the asinine "3 can't equal 1" crap. The doctrine has never asserted that.
            I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.

            Comment


            • I get a kick out of watching people kick an analogy to death and think that somehow defeats the concept of the Trinity.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                It's not hard when there is no point to miss.
                You'd have trouble hitting fish in a barrel.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                  I get a kick out of watching people kick an analogy to death and think that somehow defeats the concept of the Trinity.
                  The analogies presented neither defeat nor confirm the concept of the Trinity. They just give comfort and warm fuzzies for those that believe.
                  Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                  Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                  But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                  go with the flow the river knows . . .

                  Frank

                  I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
                    You'd have trouble hitting fish in a barrel.
                    With aim assist as well.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                      I'm not under the illusion you or any other atheist participating in this thread is genuinely trying to understand the doctrine of the Trinity.
                      Oh I can assure you I'm not. I don't think I ever claimed I was. My "trinitarian" studies are WAY behind me...(temporally)
                      The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                      I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
                        You'd have trouble hitting fish in a barrel.
                        Elephant fart in the cave!

                        WOOMP! . . . Woomp! . . . . woomp . . . . . woomp . . . . . woomp . . . . . .
                        Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                        Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                        But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                        go with the flow the river knows . . .

                        Frank

                        I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                          Elephant fart in the cave!

                          WOOMP! . . . Woomp! . . . . woomp . . . . . woomp . . . . . woomp . . . . . .


                          Don't you have anything better to do?

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                            Yes, so long as you understand that it's "3x = 1y" and "1y = 3x". It would only be a logical contradiction if it was asserted that something was both A and not-A at the same time and in the same sense, which is not at all what the doctrine of the Trinity asserts, a point that you seem intent on missing in all of your pigheaded ignorance.
                            10. The Father eternal, the Son eternal, and the Holy Spirit eternal.

                            11. And yet they are not three eternals but one eternal.

                            12. As also there are not three uncreated nor three incomprehensible, but one uncreated and one incomprehensible.

                            13. So likewise the Father is almighty, the Son almighty, and the Holy Spirit almighty.

                            14. And yet they are not three almighties, but one almighty.

                            15. So the Father is God, the Son is God, and the Holy Spirit is God;

                            16. And yet they are not three Gods, but one God.

                            ...ad infinitum.

                            https://www.ccel.org/creeds/athanasian.creed.html
                            “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                              The analogies presented neither defeat nor confirm the concept of the Trinity. They just give comfort and warm fuzzies for those that believe.
                              And, obviously, heartbreak and anxiety to those who do not.
                              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                And, obviously, heartbreak and anxiety to those who do not.
                                None whatsoever. From the strict monotheist view that I share with Jews and Muslims I have lots of company in the simplicity and wonder of God.
                                Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                                Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                                But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                                go with the flow the river knows . . .

                                Frank

                                I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                                Comment

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