Van Terror In Toronto...

[Cow Poke]

"Countless" as opposed to virtually none in nations like Canada and Australia; there is no equivalent to the "shoot 'em first, ask questions later", police violence that occurs in the USA. E.g. "14 high-profile police-related deaths of U.S. blacks".

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/list-po...-usa-1.4438618

This BTW is the first site my search engine brought up.

Would you be so kind as to point out which, if any, of the 14 examples backs up your outrageous "shoot 'em first, ask questions later" lie?

Thanks

And 14 is not "countless" - it's an actual number.

[Mountain Man]

"Countless" as opposed to virtually none in nations like Canada and Australia; there is no equivalent to the "shoot 'em first, ask questions later", police violence that occurs in the USA. E.g. "14 high-profile police-related deaths of U.S. blacks".

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/list-po...-usa-1.4438618

This BTW is the first site my search engine brought up.

So we've gone from "countless" to 14 to "This is the first thing I stumbled across in an internet search."

[Sparko]

Would you be so kind as to point out which, if any, of the 14 examples backs up your outrageous "shoot 'em first, ask questions later" lie?

Thanks

And 14 is not "countless" - it's an actual number.

Tassy only has 10 fingers, CP.

[Cow Poke]

Tassy only has 10 fingers, CP.

That's 2 1/2 more than me!

[Cow Poke]

So we've gone from "countless" to 14 to "This is the first thing I stumbled across in an internet search."

And, in NONE of those cases did the police walk up and shoot an innocent person. Not one.

[Sparko]

That's 2 1/2 more than me!

But I think you can count without using your fingers.

[Sparko]

And, in NONE of those cases did the police walk up and shoot an innocent person. Not one.

But they were black so that means they were innocent!

[Cow Poke]

When you have a criminal with a gun being faced by several police and is subsequently shot, you will have several guns all firing at once. Not to mention that in real life, people don't just fall over moaning when they are shot. Many times they just keep going for several minutes from the adrenaline before they will fall down unless the shot was fatal.

I'd love to see a study (just for grins) of the difference between incidents where the cops were armed with revolvers as opposed to semi-autos.

For the first 3 years of my police career, I carried a .357 Magnum Ruger Security Six - revolver carrying 6 live rounds. In "the heat of the moment", it's impossible to fire more than 6 rounds without reloading. Then we switched to 9mm Berettas. The first thing I noticed in live fire exercises was how EASY it was to fire more rounds than you intend, particularly right after the first round. The recoil of the handgun itself, coupled with the adrenaline coursing through your body, made the firing of the second and third rounds way too easy.

The instructor would call, for example, "three shots rapid fire - pause - three shots single fire...." And, invariably, somebody would fire more rounds than instructed. We were way more conscious of how many rounds we fired when we were firing double action.

I'm certainly NOT saying cops need to go back to double action revolvers - particularly in the current environment - but I wonder about that factor.

ETA: Also, I think we were considerably more accurate with the revolvers, because we knew we only had 6 initial rounds, and needed to make those count. When you can spray 15 or more rounds downrange, you just figure at least ONE of them will hit the target.

[Zymologist]

I'd love to see a study (just for grins) of the difference between incidents where the cops were armed with revolvers as opposed to semi-autos.

For the first 3 years of my police career, I carried a .357 Magnum Ruger Security Six - revolver carrying 6 live rounds. In "the heat of the moment", it's impossible to fire more than 6 rounds without reloading. Then we switched to 9mm Berettas. The first thing I noticed in live fire exercises was how EASY it was to fire more rounds than you intend, particularly right after the first round. The recoil of the handgun itself, coupled with the adrenaline coursing through your body, made the firing of the second and third rounds way too easy.

The instructor would call, for example, "three shots rapid fire - pause - three shots single fire...." And, invariably, somebody would fire more rounds than instructed. We were way more conscious of how many rounds we fired when we were firing double action.

I'm certainly NOT saying cops need to go back to double action revolvers - particularly in the current environment - but I wonder about that factor.

The fact that revolvers are super cool must also be considered.

[Cow Poke]

The fact that revolvers are super cool must also be considered.

I prefer my Ruger Security Six for competition shooting.

[rogue06]

I remember one of those cases and it is not as presented in the article. The case of Tamir Rice in Cleveland. Police had received calls about a man walking around pointing a gun at people. The police pulled up on the scene and ordered Rice to raise his hands. Instead of complying he grabbed the gun stuck in his waistband. At this point he was shot and killed. It all happened in less than 5 seconds.

The gun turned out to be one of those Airsoft toy guns but the orange parts that help make it clear that it was a toy had either been removed or covered over. The tragedy is that the originally 9-1-1 caller had told the police operator that he thought the gun might be fake but that part never made it to the responding officers.

IOW, hardly supportive of the case you are trying to make.

[Cow Poke]

I remember one of those cases and it is not as presented in the article. The case of Tamir Rice in Cleveland. Police had received calls about a man walking around pointing a gun at people. The police pulled up on the scene and ordered Rice to raise his hands. Instead of complying he grabbed the gun stuck in his waistband. At this point he was shot and killed. It all happened in less than 5 seconds.

The gun turned out to be one of those Airsoft toy guns but the orange parts that help make it clear that it was a toy had either been removed or covered over. The tragedy is that the originally 9-1-1 caller had told the police operator that he thought the gun might be fake but that part never made it to the responding officers.

IOW, hardly supportive of the case you are trying to make.

I skimmed through the article, being familiar with the vast majority of the "countless" [cough, sputter] 14 incidents, and they are all presented horribly "one-sided".

[Zymologist]

I remember one of those cases and it is not as presented in the article. The case of Tamir Rice in Cleveland. Police had received calls about a man walking around pointing a gun at people. The police pulled up on the scene and ordered Rice to raise his hands. Instead of complying he grabbed the gun stuck in his waistband. At this point he was shot and killed. It all happened in less than 5 seconds.

The gun turned out to be one of those Airsoft toy guns but the orange parts that help make it clear that it was a toy had either been removed or covered over. The tragedy is that the originally 9-1-1 caller had told the police operator that he thought the gun might be fake but that part never made it to the responding officers.

IOW, hardly supportive of the case you are trying to make.

No biggie, his examples are still literally innumerable.

[Cow Poke]

No biggie, his examples are still literally innumerable.

But that was only the FIRST of the countless articles on the countless shootings... wait, there's MORE!!!

[Sparko]

I'd love to see a study (just for grins) of the difference between incidents where the cops were armed with revolvers as opposed to semi-autos.

For the first 3 years of my police career, I carried a .357 Magnum Ruger Security Six - revolver carrying 6 live rounds. In "the heat of the moment", it's impossible to fire more than 6 rounds without reloading. Then we switched to 9mm Berettas. The first thing I noticed in live fire exercises was how EASY it was to fire more rounds than you intend, particularly right after the first round. The recoil of the handgun itself, coupled with the adrenaline coursing through your body, made the firing of the second and third rounds way too easy.

The instructor would call, for example, "three shots rapid fire - pause - three shots single fire...." And, invariably, somebody would fire more rounds than instructed. We were way more conscious of how many rounds we fired when we were firing double action.

I'm certainly NOT saying cops need to go back to double action revolvers - particularly in the current environment - but I wonder about that factor.

ETA: Also, I think we were considerably more accurate with the revolvers, because we knew we only had 6 initial rounds, and needed to make those count. When you can spray 15 or more rounds downrange, you just figure at least ONE of them will hit the target.

Trying to shoot rapidly also messes up the accuracy because of the recoil. It's hard to line the shot back up after the gun barrel flies up in the air after every shot.