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NFL’s Proposed National Anthem Rules

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  • #61
    Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    Why on earth do I care how much they are getting paid?
    Obviously, you don't, cause you're a pinko commie leftist radical pretending to be a centrist. (slight exaggeration, again )

    If I, as a free market capitalist, were paying BIG BUCKS for somebody to play on my TEAM, and they chose to promote their own agenda in such a way as to cause me a serious revenue decrease, I'd have to have a talk with them about their priorities. Do they want to continue to play ball AS A TEAM, or would they like to have more free time to advance their own agenda.

    I don't give a flyin' flip if it was Trump who turned it into a mess or not, if the guy works for ME, he needs to seriously consider his loyalties.
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
      Calm yourself, Carpe, your "self-promoting-so-and-so" nonsense is nowhere near my attitude toward these players, and it's disingenuous of you to imply it is. I think, when you get challenged, your "I'm such a nice guy" facade begins to slip.
      I really had to chuckle at this one. What on earth makes you think I'm not calm?

      And when I use "wonder" without a question mark, I can see how different backgrounds can lead to different understandings, but when I explicitly ask a question, complete with question mark, I am still "implying" something? CP - you're not showing a great deal of consistency.

      And I have no idea what the "I'm such a nice guy" comment refers to. I have not, to my knowledge, made a claim to "be a nice guy." I post, I debate, I discuss, and I try to avoid calling people names or treating them disrespectfully. That's about as "nice" as I get. I don't have a "facade" that I know of, but I'm assuming from your comment that you think I do?
      The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

      I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
        I recommend you do check. Sparko's list of events is accurate, to my knowledge.
        From what I can tell, yes....

        But the general media coverage was relatively muted - until Trump chimed in and began pounding the drum in tweets, at his rallies, and any other speaking opportunity where he could wedge it in. The number of players involved and the media coverage skyrocketed at that point.
        I think this has a whole lot more to do with your disdain for Trump than you will ever admit.
        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
          Obviously, you don't, cause you're a pinko commie leftist radical pretending to be a centrist. (slight exaggeration, again )
          (you earned that one... )

          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
          If I, as a free market capitalist, were paying BIG BUCKS for somebody to play on my TEAM, and they chose to promote their own agenda in such a way as to cause me a serious revenue decrease, I'd have to have a talk with them about their priorities. Do they want to continue to play ball AS A TEAM, or would they like to have more free time to advance their own agenda.

          I don't give a flyin' flip if it was Trump who turned it into a mess or not, if the guy works for ME, he needs to seriously consider his loyalties.
          If money was my primary objective in life - I probably would to. Money is pretty far down on my list. Apparently, it is true for many of the club owners too, because many supported their team's actions. Yet the NFL saw fit to put a global rule in place. Interesting, that...
          The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

          I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
            From what I can tell, yes....

            I think this has a whole lot more to do with your disdain for Trump than you will ever admit.
            Your opinion and $3.75 will get you something to drink at Starbuck's...

            And then you accuse me of "implying" and "making assumptions"...?

            Really, CP, you're not being very consistent.

            But it's OK - you're old and a redneck. We don't expect much more from you...
            The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

            I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
              Your opinion and $3.75 will get you something to drink at Starbuck's...

              And then you accuse me of "implying" and "making assumptions"...?

              Really, CP, you're not being very consistent.

              But it's OK - you're old and a redneck. We don't expect much more from you...
              We? The voices in your head again?
              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
                If money was my primary objective in life - I probably would to.
                too

                Money is pretty far down on my list. Apparently, it is true for many of the club owners too, because many supported their team's actions. Yet the NFL saw fit to put a global rule in place. Interesting, that...
                "Many" of the club owners? The first word out was that it was a unanimous decision....

                ATLANTA -- NFL owners have unanimously approved a new national anthem policy that requires players to stand if they are on the field during the performance but gives them the option to remain in the locker room if they prefer, it was announced Wednesday.

                source


                It seems SOME of them are backing away, or commissioner Roger Goodell is a liar - I don't know.
                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                  We? The voices in your head again?
                  I'm a self-contained trinity...
                  The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                  I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                    too
                    Dam it!

                    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                    "Many" of the club owners? The first word out was that it was a unanimous decision....

                    ATLANTA -- NFL owners have unanimously approved a new national anthem policy that requires players to stand if they are on the field during the performance but gives them the option to remain in the locker room if they prefer, it was announced Wednesday.

                    source


                    It seems SOME of them are backing away, or commissioner Roger Goodell is a liar - I don't know.
                    http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports...924-story.html

                    That was not their position in the fall. A lot of owners supported their players - and some even went out and locked arms with them in solidarity. As for the vote - I have no idea who is being genuine and who is not.
                    The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                    I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
                      That was not their position in the fall....
                      That was then. They've had some time to see the impact on their bottom line. Did I mention the NFL is a business?
                      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                        That was then. They've had some time to see the impact on their bottom line. Did I mention the NFL is a business?
                        You might have mentioned it once or twice...
                        The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                        I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
                          You might have mentioned it once or twice...
                          So, just out of curiosity, and I know I'll regret asking, do you think the manner in which the protested was the best way to do this?
                          Do you think they didn't there'd be opposition?
                          Do you think it's really done anything for their 'cause'?
                          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                            So, just out of curiosity, and I know I'll regret asking, do you think the manner in which the protested was the best way to do this?
                            Yes

                            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                            Do you think they didn't there'd be opposition?
                            This is a horrible sentence...


                            (ok - I enjoyed that...)

                            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                            Do you think it's really done anything for their 'cause'?
                            Hard to tell. It has raised awareness for sure. Not sure if that has trickled into actual changes. Frankly, it's unlikely so long as Republicans remain in charge. The general impression is that any criticism of our police force is unamerican and unappreciative of their sacrifice. But any group of people will have strengths and weaknesses. We can criticize the weaknesses without disparaging the commitment and sacrifice these men and women make. And if you put a gun in the hands of a law-keeper, there had better be pretty darned good procedures in place to make sure that no bad apples have entered the bunch, and to weed them out if/when they do. A bad cop reflects badly on the entire institution. One would think that the police would themselves have a vested interest in policing their own. Sometimes, it seems like there is a little too much "circling the wagons."

                            On the other hand, I do understand that police are one of the more disparaged groups out there. That makes the sacrifice they make all that much more amazing.

                            I'd be very curious about something. I have been watching Blue Bloods lately, and I find myself thinking it is an amazingly honest look at the police force and the pressures and hostility they face. Do you agree - or is it just so much entertainment with little/no grounding in reality? I DO recognize that they have a lot of shooting and drama that most police do not experience in the real world. Indeed, I remember an episode when the commissioner (Tom Selleck) made an observation that there had only been 35 officer-involved shooting incidents in the previous year and I found myself thinking, "24 of those were the last 24 episodes and involved one or both of your sons!"
                            The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                            I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
                              Hard to tell. It has raised awareness for sure.
                              I had feeling you would say that. What does that even mean? You think there wasn't ALREADY "awareness"? And does "raising it" actually do anything? How do you know it didn't encourage some of the scumbags who killed police officers in cold blood, or intensified the hatred of the "bad cops" who were on the edge anyway?

                              Not sure if that has trickled into actual changes.
                              I would seriously doubt it.

                              Frankly, it's unlikely so long as Republicans remain in charge.
                              And, when Republicans are no longer "in charge" (assuming they are) there will suddenly be blue skies and sunshine and unicorns will....

                              The general impression is that any criticism of our police force is unamerican and unappreciative of their sacrifice.
                              Wow, what a broad brush. The impression from whom? You're starting to sound like JimL here.

                              But any group of people will have strengths and weaknesses. We can criticize the weaknesses without disparaging the commitment and sacrifice these men and women make. And if you put a gun in the hands of a law-keeper, there had better be pretty darned good procedures in place to make sure that no bad apples have entered the bunch, and to weed them out if/when they do. A bad cop reflects badly on the entire institution. One would think that the police would themselves have a vested interest in policing their own. Sometimes, it seems like there is a little too much "circling the wagons."

                              On the other hand, I do understand that police are one of the more disparaged groups out there. That makes the sacrifice they make all that much more amazing.
                              And, you think "raising awareness" might not have actually made that worse? When you take a false narrative like "hands up - don't shoot", and whip it into a frenzy....

                              I'd be very curious about something. I have been watching Blue Bloods lately, and I find myself thinking it is an amazingly honest look at the police force and the pressures and hostility they face. Do you agree - or is it just so much entertainment with little/no grounding in reality?
                              I very RARELY find myself thinking "oh, come on, it's not like that!" I think they do a great job of handling a lot of issues, and showing the difficulties of the job, even the racially sensitive issues.

                              I DO recognize that they have a lot of shooting and drama that most police do not experience in the real world.
                              Yes, THAT part is over the top, but not NEARLY as over the top as the fact that Danny so often ends up investigating a case that Jaime is called to, and Erin is the prosecutor, and Frank... it's "all in the family" like majorly a LOT.

                              Indeed, I remember an episode when the commissioner (Tom Selleck) made an observation that there had only been 35 officer-involved shooting incidents in the previous year and I found myself thinking, "24 of those were the last 24 episodes and involved one or both of your sons!"
                              EGGzackly... and "I have 35,000 cops I have to consider"... but his sons... yeah.

                              I especially like it that they always have Sunday dinner and they always "say Grace".
                              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Before anything else...I am stunned that you cut out your horrible sentence...

                                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                I had feeling you would say that. What does that even mean? You think there wasn't ALREADY "awareness"? And does "raising it" actually do anything? How do you know it didn't encourage some of the scumbags who killed police officers in cold blood, or intensified the hatred of the "bad cops" who were on the edge anyway?
                                It means that more people are likely to be aware of the problem than were before this protests began. And yes, I think there wasn't already awareness. I do believe that bringing an injustice into the light ultimately is a good thing. And yes, I believe there is adequate evidence to suggest that there is implicit bias in how people are treated by many police officers. And no, I don' think that makes "police bad."

                                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                I would seriously doubt it.


                                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                And, when Republicans are no longer "in charge" (assuming they are) there will suddenly be blue skies and sunshine and unicorns will....
                                No - but I do think it is more likely we will have some of the approaches Obama took, which was to encourage studies and recommend education.

                                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                Wow, what a broad brush. The impression from whom? You're starting to sound like JimL here.
                                From right-leaning media and the posts here. Criticism of the police force is typically met with significant resistance.

                                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                And, you think "raising awareness" might not have actually made that worse? When you take a false narrative like "hands up - don't shoot", and whip it into a frenzy....
                                I think that people are prone to develop attitudes that align with their experiences. When most of the people you encounter that are engaged in violent crimes are black, it becomes easy to assume the next black person is a risk. When most of the ghettos where crime happens are occupied by black people, it becomes easy to assume the next black person is a risk. Implicit bias in understandable. It simply is not defensible.

                                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                I very RARELY find myself thinking "oh, come on, it's not like that!" I think they do a great job of handling a lot of issues, and showing the difficulties of the job, even the racially sensitive issues.

                                Yes, THAT part is over the top, but not NEARLY as over the top as the fact that Danny so often ends up investigating a case that Jaime is called to, and Erin is the prosecutor, and Frank... it's "all in the family" like majorly a LOT.

                                EGGzackly... and "I have 35,000 cops I have to consider"... but his sons... yeah.

                                I especially like it that they always have Sunday dinner and they always "say Grace".
                                It sounds like we have the same impression of the show. I too like their family dinners. The grace I can take or leave (mostly leave). I find myself wondering if I made a mistake encouraging my boys to be independent, and not blindly devoted to "family." As they grow up - we grow apart.

                                It hurts...
                                The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                                I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                                Comment

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