Announcement

Collapse

Civics 101 Guidelines

Want to argue about politics? Healthcare reform? Taxes? Governments? You've come to the right place!

Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
See more
See less

SCOTUS & gay wedding cakes

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
    Of course not. Pizza makers are "PIZZA ARTISTS"...same as CP's "cake artists" above.
    That you would compare spreading out bread, adding ingredients and putting it into the oven to baking a cake, then spending hours designing and decorating it shows that you know absolutely nothing about wedding cakes. And it wasn't about the pizza - that was a goofus cite - it was about the catering.

    Tassman: yup, wedding cakes are just like pizzas!
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
      That you would compare spreading out bread, adding ingredients and putting it into the oven to baking a cake, then spending hours designing and decorating it shows that you know absolutely nothing about wedding cakes. And it wasn't about the pizza - that was a goofus cite - it was about the catering.

      Tassman: yup, wedding cakes are just like pizzas!
      LOL,

      Yeah there is nothing artistic about these cakes, right? You can just buy them at Dunkin Donuts, probably.






      Comment


      • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
        LOL,

        Yeah there is nothing artistic about these cakes, right? You can just buy them at Dunkin Donuts, probably.
        I must admit I purposely used the term "cake artist", because I knew it would elicit the goofus "But it's JUST A CAKE" argument.

        It did.

        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
          LOL,

          Yeah there is nothing artistic about these cakes, right? You can just buy them at Dunkin Donuts, probably.





          If I could do it, it is not art - I couldn't do those, so they are art!
          Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
            That you would compare spreading out bread, adding ingredients and putting it into the oven to baking a cake, then spending hours designing and decorating it shows that you know absolutely nothing about wedding cakes. And it wasn't about the pizza - that was a goofus cite - it was about the catering.
            I'm very fussy about my pizza's thank you very much. And I've never seen wedding cakes like those exceptionally fanciful efforts that Sparko posted...and I've been to many weddings. Obviously, if you search for extreme examples you will find something, but the exceptions to the rule do not support your case for discrimination. The argument remains, that a cake-maker in a Public Accommodation cannot discriminate under the Law.
            “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
              Yeah there is nothing artistic about these cakes, right? You can just buy them at Dunkin Donuts, probably.
              Of the 3 cakes you depict, I would say the second two are artistic in the sense of being prettily decorated. But in the sense of depicting "art as speech", they are not exactly original masterpieces of imaginative free speech depicted using art, but rather prettily decorated generic wedding cakes. In that sense, I absolutely wouldn't be surprised to see someone make cookie-cutter copies on them and mass sell them at Dunkin Donuts or equivalent.

              The first one you depicted, however, was an original artwork which imaginatively combined many concepts that may well have been customized for the particular couple and their preferences and life goals etc. I can see a case for arguing this is the kind of free-speech artistic license the first amendment might be construed to cover.
              "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
              "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
              "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                Of the 3 cakes you depict, I would say the second two are artistic in the sense of being prettily decorated. But in the sense of depicting "art as speech", they are not exactly original masterpieces of imaginative free speech depicted using art, but rather prettily decorated generic wedding cakes. In that sense, I absolutely wouldn't be surprised to see someone make cookie-cutter copies on them and mass sell them at Dunkin Donuts or equivalent.
                I wonder if you people are really this dense, or if you're just playing so to try to believe your own nonsense. This is PROBABLY changing with our culture, but a wedding has always been a very special event to a woman, and the wedding cake was a huge part of that. She wants her cake to reflect her own wedding - to be special - different. It is a YUGE deal to have the wedding cake express that specialness.

                The first one you depicted, however, was an original artwork which imaginatively combined many concepts that may well have been customized for the particular couple and their preferences and life goals etc. I can see a case for arguing this is the kind of free-speech artistic license the first amendment might be construed to cover.
                And that kind of thing is pretty much regulated by budget. Weddings are very expensive, and a large part of that expense is the cake.
                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                  LOL,

                  Yeah there is nothing artistic about these cakes, right? You can just buy them at Dunkin Donuts, probably.





                  I'm sure Starlight, Tassman or JimL can whip one of them up in an hour. Just shake and bake.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
                    I'm sure Starlight, Tassman or JimL can whip one of them up in an hour. Just shake and bake.
                    After all, it's JUST A CAKE!
                    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Starlight
                      two are artistic in the sense of being prettily decorated. But in the sense of depicting "art as speech", they are not exactly original masterpieces of imaginative free speech
                      I've never seen a No True Scotsman used about cakes. They're art Starlight, they're specific, they can be charged with religious or cultural symbolism. For instance if a couple was crazy Redskins fans, and wanted a wedding cake in the shape of that mascot, I would also grant that a baker who's sensitive to such issues would decline from making something like that.

                      And as we've said before on this thread, if the baker had a Standard-A Form Wedding Cake sold with implements to write messages on it etc - likely at reduced cost, I don't see any Christians who'd lose sleep over selling something like that, no matter what purpose it was used for.

                      I personally don't care how excrementally ugly you think those cakes are. Freedom of Speech don't merely cover those few things which are worth keeping.
                      Last edited by Leonhard; 08-01-2018, 10:34 AM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                        After all, it's JUST A CAKE!
                        At my little sisters wedding we made one ourselves. Got the icing almost perfect too, decorated it with little flowers made of icing. The big crack in the icing we hid by turning it towards the wall. Gallons of cream had been boiled to form the filling. And thankfully one of my little sisters friends knew how to write with molten chocolate.

                        We saved a great deal of money. But it was finished the night before at the last minute. And compared to those cakes, this one was pretty plain.

                        It was a wonderful wedding btw. My little sister married a man I really respect.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
                          At my little sisters wedding we made one ourselves. Got the icing almost perfect too, decorated it with little flowers made of icing. The big crack in the icing we hid by turning it towards the wall. Gallons of cream had been boiled to form the filling. And thankfully one of my little sisters friends knew how to write with molten chocolate.

                          We saved a great deal of money. But it was finished the night before at the last minute. And compared to those cakes, this one was pretty plain.

                          It was a wonderful wedding btw. My little sister married a man I really respect.
                          Yeah, weddings can be horiffically expensive, and the cake is one of those elements where people will often try to save money. Because getting a cake from a CAKE ARTIST is quite a process!

                          It's good you have acceptable extended family!
                          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
                            I'm sure Starlight, Tassman or JimL can whip one of them up in an hour. Just shake and bake.
                            Is the bottom cake a heterosexual cake or a gay cake? The baker simply refused to bake a cake for a gay wedding, design had nothing to do with it.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                              Is the bottom cake a heterosexual cake or a gay cake? The baker simply refused to bake a cake for a gay wedding, design had nothing to do with it.
                              He refused to use his artistic talents and expression to make a cake for an event he thinks is a sin.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                                He refused to use his artistic talents and expression to make a cake for an event he thinks is a sin.
                                Right, so just as you have argued in the past, it has nothing to do with the cake itself, it has to do with the event, and the event has to do with the nature of the people participating in the event, which is therefore discrimination against the people themselves no less so than if he refused to make a cake for the wedding of an interacial couple.

                                Comment

                                Related Threads

                                Collapse

                                Topics Statistics Last Post
                                Started by little_monkey, 03-27-2024, 04:19 PM
                                16 responses
                                155 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post One Bad Pig  
                                Started by whag, 03-26-2024, 04:38 PM
                                53 responses
                                400 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Mountain Man  
                                Started by rogue06, 03-26-2024, 11:45 AM
                                25 responses
                                114 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post rogue06
                                by rogue06
                                 
                                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-26-2024, 09:21 AM
                                33 responses
                                198 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Roy
                                by Roy
                                 
                                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-26-2024, 08:34 AM
                                84 responses
                                373 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post JimL
                                by JimL
                                 
                                Working...
                                X