Originally posted by lilpixieofterror
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Separating immigrant families and imprisoning children
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"I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
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Originally posted by Sparko View PostThe ACLU is already complaining about Trump signing the executive order that Schumer wanted him to sign, keeping the parents and children together in the detention centers.Last edited by Mountain Man; 06-21-2018, 07:40 AM.Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
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Originally posted by Starlight View PostApparently you can make this stuff up... I called LittleJoe a woman?!? Are you confusing this with MM or CP calling me a drama queen?
Originally posted by Starlight View PostDoes she not realize that Brexit was majorly about immigration concerns? Though nothing would surprise me about her levels of ignorance at this point.Last edited by lilpixieofterror; 06-21-2018, 07:42 AM."The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy
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Originally posted by carpedm9587 View PostWhen I look at newspapers and "fact check" sites, I look for consistency across common media.
I suppose this is despite the fact that many liberal sources basically copy from each other without bothering to check the veracity of the original claim -- apropos to this thread, the recent Obama-era pictures of kids in cages that made their rounds and were falsely attributed to the Trump administration; nobody bothered to check the original source and just parroted what each other said.Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
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Originally posted by Starlight View PostApparently you can make this stuff up... I called LittleJoe a woman?!?Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.
MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.
MM on climate change: Looking at the historical temperature data in my region over the past ten years shows that temperatures have been stable ...
mikewhitney: What if the speed of light changed when light is passing through water? ... I have 3 semesters of college Physics.
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Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View PostSo you don’t care that a group of partisan hacks are trying to pass themselves off as impartial judges of truth?
Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
Sanders: responded to clarifying questions
Trump: did not respond to clarifying questions
Sanders: used older data
Trump: used current data
Sanders: used the data consistently with its intent (unemployed and underemployed)
Trump: took data with one intent (employment percentage) and "flipped" it resulting in use of the data that does not align with conventional use
Sanders: rated "mostly true"
Trump: rated "mostly false"
I actually concur with the distinction. While Sanders used more dated numbers and needs to update them, Trump attempted to ignore the actual unemployment statistics for black youth, and replace them with 100% - "employed black youth." But "unemployment," as the article states, has a well-defined meaning and use in employment statistics (those actively seeking work). This is intentional. There are always people in any population that don't want to be working. They may be in college and have scholarships, they could be living with and supporting parents who are financially supporting them in turn, they could be doing unpaid internships, they could be disabled, and so forth. The unemployment number specifically seeks to exclude these and focus on those who want to be working and are not. Trump essentially ignored this distinction to exaggerate the numbers.
Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View PostGlad you do.
And can you show where I said this isn’t an issue on both sides?
Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View PostAnd yet you show a history of being far harder on sources from the right vs the left.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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Originally posted by rogue06 View PostI don't think that I've ever seen you merely dismiss anything as a left-wing meme.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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Originally posted by Starlight View PostThe lawyer was saying the situation changed dramatically post-2007, so your anecdotes from the 90s aren't exactly relevant. He said all border-crossers he's met among the thousands of illegal immigrants he's worked with (in D.C. where he works) crossed pre-2007 with none having crossed subsequent to that, and that 100% of illegals he's encountered who entered post-2007 were visa over-stayers.The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Sparko View PostSo have I. And rogue. And Seer, and I believe Mountain Man. Go back and read the thread.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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It's curious to me that liberals blast Trump for enforcing the law (as he should), but don't have a single word of criticism for those who violate it.Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
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Originally posted by Starlight View PostA lot of studies on the topic have found that left-wingers tend to fact-check at a much higher rate than right-wingers (probably at least partially because they believe in the inherent validity of fact-checking websites), so false memes have a very short lifetime on the left, while false right-wing memes tend to spread unchecked.
Some happen to do so incredibly poorly. Politifact for instance said thst combined occupy democrats and the 98 percent were almost never sccurate.sigpic
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Originally posted by carpedm9587 View PostIf you can find a place where I responded to someone posting a left-wing meme that I did not call them on...please let me know. I (hopefully) am not that partisan.Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom
Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist
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Originally posted by carpedm9587 View PostI believe I have responded to all of the posted links and sources. If there is one I have not, let me know.
Discussions with you are like the Marx Bros. routine where Groucho reads a lengthy contract with Chico repeatedly objecting, "I don'a like that; take it out," until the contract is reduced to nothing but a line and the words "Sign Here".Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
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Originally posted by Sparko View Postdepends entirely on the misdemeanor and circumstance. If the crime involves avoiding the authorities or a flight risk, then they are arrested.
Originally posted by Sparko View PostAre you insane?
Originally posted by Sparko View PostGive a ticket to people who do not have papers, are not citizens and have no permanent address? That are trying to sneak into the country illegally? Exactly how would that work? Please. Tell me.
First, we're talking about families only. There is no need to do so for adults traveling independently, they can be prosecuted and detained.
Second, statistically, 67% of so-called "catch-and-release" immigrants actually show up for their immigration review (the 80% don't show up number is false).
Third, the number of illegal immigrants entering/captured is below 500K per year and dropping.
Fourth, "parents with children" is a subset of the incoming immigrant flow, so it is a fraction of the 500K number. I do not know what that fraction is (half? quarter? three fourths?) and cannot find the number.
These are things we know. I also offer the following speculations:
First, I suspect the percentage actually showing up for their immigration hearings is likely higher for families. They are more likely to get leniency, and it is harder to hide an entire family than a single adult or couple. Parents tend to want to care for their kids.
Second, I suspect the number of crimes committed by adults with children is significantly lower than that committed by independent adults entering illegally.
So, we're talking about possibly limiting "catch and release" to a portion of the incoming illegal immigrants (families), that have a decent likelihood of showing up for their hearings, and a low probability of committing crimes.
I'm not seeing something here to get me all that concerned with the idea. It would be better if we had some sort of tracking system for such families (e.g., the house-arrest bracelets used by law enforcement), or perhaps U.S.-based "host families" willing to take legal responsibility (I would sign up for that in a flat minute).
Originally posted by Sparko View PostThe law says that someone who enters the country illegally is arrested. Where they keep them is called a jail. Whether it is in a warehouse or an actual jail, it is the same thing. The liberals will not be happy unless the parents and children are released and free to enter the country. The ACLU is already complaining about Trump signing the executive order that Schumer wanted him to sign, keeping the parents and children together in the detention centers.
Originally posted by Sparko View PostWho said they are going to a federal prison??????
Show me that!Last edited by carpedm9587; 06-21-2018, 08:58 AM.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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Originally posted by Mountain Man View PostIn other words, if multiple liberally biased sources all tell you what you want to hear then that's good enough for you.
Originally posted by Mountain Man View PostI suppose this is despite the fact that many liberal sources basically copy from each other without bothering to check the veracity of the original claim -- apropos to this thread, the recent Obama-era pictures of kids in cages that made their rounds and were falsely attributed to the Trump administration; nobody bothered to check the original source and just parroted what each other said.
Perhaps one positive side of the relentless attack on media that Trump is waging is that media outlets are getting more and more sensitive to error. Perhaps we will see that dynamic reversed as a result.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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