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Separating immigrant families and imprisoning children

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  • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    I don't think that government - especially the federal government - should generally be in the business of charity. 1) They're horribly inefficient with it. 2) It gives people a convenient excuse for not assisting others themselves.
    I don't see how that answers the questions. Let's repeat one of them:

    Would Jesus not care about the consequences for "the least of these" if only you make sure that the government and not you yourself is responsible for their suffering and you "only" voted for them?
    "Yes. President Trump is a huge embarrassment. And it’s an embarrassment to evangelical Christianity that there appear to be so many who will celebrate precisely the aspects that I see Biblically as most lamentable and embarrassing." Southern Baptist leader Albert Mohler Jr.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
      While we're at it, let's pretend that drug runners and coyotes would never, ever, take unrelated children along as cover.
      There is no reason to think this is the case, but it's a bit hard to say when the government has lost the children because no proper records were kept. This is the real issue, not the manufactured possibility that the children were brought along by drug runners and coyotes.
      “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
        You and the left's pretending to care about the children while crying about the possibility of SCOTUS preventing the ability of mothers to kill their own babies makes your protestations meaningless. And the law has been in effect since before Obama actually. Congress has the power to change it. Yet they refuse to do so.
        Yes we all know that the PRO-BIRTH PARTY cares more about insensate fetuses in the womb than actual real live children suffering because of heartless policies enacted by a racist president pandering to his racist base by trying to look tough on brown-skinned asylum seekers.
        “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Charles View Post
          So if others did something you morally disagree with then you are of the hook and don't have to reflect on what you support and the consequences it has for other human beings? Or did I misunderstand you?
          It's the "okay, we might be wrong on ALL the other issues, but we totally think we're right on abortion, so it doesn't matter" excuse.
          "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
          "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
          "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
            Yes we all know that the PRO-BIRTH PARTY cares more about insensate fetuses in the womb than actual real live children suffering because of heartless policies enacted by a racist president pandering to his racist base by trying to look tough on brown-skinned asylum seekers.
            It's essential that fetuses get born so that the gun nuts have people to massacre, ICE has children to kidnap, and the US military has people to kill. Aren't the pro-life values obvious?
            "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
            "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
            "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Charles View Post
              So if others did something you morally disagree with then you are of the hook and don't have to reflect on what you support and the consequences it has for other human beings? Or did I misunderstand you?

              I have no clue what you just asked.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
                Yes we all know that the PRO-BIRTH PARTY cares more about insensate fetuses in the womb than actual real live children suffering because of heartless policies enacted by a racist president pandering to his racist base by trying to look tough on brown-skinned asylum seekers.
                You mean more about unborn babies than people trying to illegally entering our country by the thousands and being turned away or arrested? The children would not be suffering if their parents didn't drag them thousands of miles across a desert without food and water. Maybe they should be arrested. We arrest parents who leave their children in hot cars in the summer. We call it child abuse.

                Trump is following the law. Actually ICE is following the law. Just like they did under Obama and Bush. Trump just happens to be president right now so all of a sudden it is a horrible policy and his fault. If it is so horrible, then why didn't congress fix it under Obama?

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                  You mean more about unborn babies than people trying to illegally entering our country by the thousands and being turned away or arrested? The children would not be suffering if their parents didn't drag them thousands of miles across a desert without food and water. Maybe they should be arrested. We arrest parents who leave their children in hot cars in the summer. We call it child abuse.
                  That they are dragging their children thousands of miles across a dessert without food or water, many dying enroute, should tell you something about the abuse they are trying to escape from.
                  Trump is following the law. Actually ICE is following the law. Just like they did under Obama and Bush. Trump just happens to be president right now so all of a sudden it is a horrible policy and his fault. If it is so horrible, then why didn't congress fix it under Obama?
                  No, actually not just like they did under Obama. Get your head out of Fox News, Sparko.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                    You and the left's pretending to care about the children while crying about the possibility of SCOTUS preventing the ability of mothers to kill their own babies makes your protestations meaningless. And the law has been in effect since before Obama actually. Congress has the power to change it. Yet they refuse to do so.
                    The left doesn't seem to care all that much about families and children when you look at the consequences of their actions they say are designed to help them.

                    Their policies created a permanent underclass as generation after generation became reliant on government hand outs. They led to the breakup of families because you can get a substantially bigger check if the father isn't in the picture (virtually all experts agree that a stable family that includes a father is a crucial component for raising children). Prior to welfare black families were even more stable than white families. Now roughly two thirds of blacks are raised in single parent households.

                    One could be forgiven for suspecting that this was by design although it is far more likely the result of unintended consequences that liberals then seized upon as a desirable outcome since it produced a reliable voter base.



                    The left also points to their willingness to shovel money at education willy-nilly without any thought of accountability as further evidence of their support of kids and families. But it seems more motivated by funneling money to teacher's unions who then contribute huge amounts back into Democrat coffers[1]. Am I being too cynical? Then explain if educating children was the goal why do liberals tend to fight tooth and nail against any ideas to improve education that doesn't include massive transfers of money such as charter schools and school choice?

                    And if liberal policies are the best way to improve education then why are they in complete control of the worst school districts and systems in spite of massive outlays of money?[2]

                    Moreover, if throwing money at the problem is the solution then why are (at least when I last looked) many of the states with the lowest per student expenditures are the ones where students did the best and likewise many of those with the highest per student expenditures are the ones where students did the worst. Further (again, the last time I checked), Americans spend more on schooling than the vast majority of countries that outscore us on the international tests.















                    1. For instance, according to Open Secrets, the American Federation of Teachers donated $7,919,897 to politicians and political groups with $7,888,355 going to Democrats and liberals (99.9%) and $6500 to Republicans and conservatives

                    2. I cannot help thinking about how when, back in the mid-80s a federal judge ordered that billions of dollars be spent upgrading Kansas City's schools. The educrats were giddy with delight. They set about adding enormous gyms to the schools, built an Olympic swimming pool, TV studios, a planetarium, a zoo, and a wildlife sanctuary. After burning through $2 Billion it was discovered that not a single new textbook was purchased and IIRC not a single new teacher was hired (although a lot more administrators were).

                    Results? The schools got worse. Markedly so.

                    Something like five years later the Kansas City school district failed 11 performance standards and lost its academic accreditation for the first time in the district’s history.

                    I'm always still in trouble again

                    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                    "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                      No, actually not just like they did under Obama. Get your head out of Fox News, Sparko.
                      What exactly are the differences?

                      I'm always still in trouble again

                      "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                      "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                      "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                        Typical conservative excuse for maintaining their support for selfish immoral government.
                        Are you high?
                        Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                        Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                        sigpic
                        I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Charles View Post
                          I don't see how that answers the questions. Let's repeat one of them:
                          I answered the way I did because your question is largely irrelevant to my view of charity. My voting choices are never made on a single point of contention, and invariably I'm left with picking the least worst option. Jesus is speaking about what I should do, not what I think others should do.
                          Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                          Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                          sigpic
                          I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                            Are you high?
                            JimL preparing-to-post.gif
                            jimmy preparing to post

                            I'm always still in trouble again

                            "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                            "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                            "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                              You mean more about unborn babies
                              No, I mean insensate fetuses without a functioning brain as compared to actual real live children suffering because of heartless policies enacted by a racist president pandering to his racist base by trying to look tough on brown-skinned asylum seekers.

                              than people trying to illegally entering our country by the thousands and being turned away or arrested? The children would not be suffering if their parents didn't drag them thousands of miles across a desert without food and water. Maybe they should be arrested. We arrest parents who leave their children in hot cars in the summer. We call it child abuse.
                              "Child abuse" is the forced separation of children from their mothers.

                              Do you realise that the “suffering" to which you refer, was because these mothers were escaping: “The killing of a loved one. An attempt at gang recruitment. A rape. Harassment by a police officer. A death threat over an outstanding extortion payment. Amid the justified uproar at the Trump administration’s policies on America’s southern border, often lost are the reasons many Central Americans leave their homes, and are prepared to brave the perils of the journey north, in the first place. “

                              https://www.theatlantic.com/internat...ration/563744/

                              Do you care?

                              Trump is following the law. Actually ICE is following the law. Just like they did under Obama and Bush. Trump just happens to be president right now so all of a sudden it is a horrible policy and his fault. If it is so horrible, then why didn't congress fix it under Obama?
                              There is no law that mandates separating children from their parents. Trump’s own administration devised a policy to that effect.
                              “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
                                No, I mean insensate fetuses without a functioning brain as compared to actual real live children suffering because of heartless policies enacted by a racist president pandering to his racist base by trying to look tough on brown-skinned asylum seekers.



                                "Child abuse" is the forced separation of children from their mothers.

                                Do you realise that the “suffering" to which you refer, was because these mothers were escaping: “The killing of a loved one. An attempt at gang recruitment. A rape. Harassment by a police officer. A death threat over an outstanding extortion payment. Amid the justified uproar at the Trump administration’s policies on America’s southern border, often lost are the reasons many Central Americans leave their homes, and are prepared to brave the perils of the journey north, in the first place. “

                                https://www.theatlantic.com/internat...ration/563744/

                                Do you care?



                                There is no law that mandates separating children from their parents. Trump’s own administration devised a policy to that effect.
                                We have rapes, murders, gangs and police harassment right here Tassy. They aren't escaping anything. And when it happens here, you don't see people running off to another country, dragging their children through the desert, do you?

                                If they need asylum, they can apply for it like everyone else.

                                Comment

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