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Originally posted by 37818
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I "comprehend", but why would I accept the veracity of a nonsensical claim being cited many decades after it was alleged to have been made?“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams. -
The writer was an eyewitness to Jesus saying it. But then that makes little difference to you. And you have no inclination, as far as I know, to test self authentication of the claim made in the text.Originally posted by Tassman View PostLast edited by 37818; 07-09-2018, 02:17 PM.. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJVComment
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Well, would you be willing to test the self authentication of the text?Originally posted by Doug Shaver View Post. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJVComment
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Why?Originally posted by JimL View Post. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJVComment
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There are no known first person witnesses recording what Jesus said during his life time.Originally posted by 37818 View PostLast edited by shunyadragon; 07-09-2018, 09:15 PM.Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:
go with the flow the river knows . . .
Frank
I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.Comment
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Why? Because I've been following the discussion and I can see you're a true believer. I believe there is no argument, no set of facts, there is nothing that is going to change your mind, except perhaps time.Originally posted by 37818 View PostComment
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There are no eyewitness accounts of the Jesus story. Anything Jesus is claimed to have said is anecdotal and most probably embellished.Originally posted by 37818 View Post“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.Comment
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I don't believe any text can authenticate itself. I think self-authentication is an apologetic gimmick intended to mask a circular argument.Originally posted by 37818 View PostComment
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I believe that much of the words of Jesus are mostly valid as oral traditions, and recorded after his death. Yes there is evidence that the gospels represent an evolved embellished account of the life of Jesus, but what is known about the word of the founders of religions like Jesus and Buddha a great deal of effort was made to preserve the words of the founder. The evolution of the gospels, the writings out side the NT such as the Sayings of Jesus' also indicate an effort to preserve the words of Jesus even though obviously embellished by commentary.Originally posted by Tassman View PostGlendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:
go with the flow the river knows . . .
Frank
I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.Comment
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Ok, then give one specific case. Cite the reference and give he circular example.Originally posted by Doug Shaver View Post. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJVComment
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Well, your are arguing that Matthew, John and Peter and the witnesses Luke interviewed are not.Originally posted by Tassman View Post. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJVComment
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What compelling truth do you know that disallows what you understand I believe?Originally posted by JimL View Post. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJVComment
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That there is nothing going to change the belief that you've so long cultivated.Originally posted by 37818 View PostComment
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Your asking to prove the negative. It is up to one making the claim to provr or at least demonstrate the positives based on evidence, The responsibility is yours.Originally posted by 37818 View PostGlendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:
go with the flow the river knows . . .
Frank
I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.Comment
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If there is a compelling truth in evidence, how is that proving a negative, except against the one who believes contrary to it would be wrong?Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJVComment
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