Originally posted by rogue06
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Roe V Wade Is Doomed...
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“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostJust what is the significance of an insensate, fetus without a functioning brain, that is unable to survive outside the mother's body?
Does the mother have no rights of her own?The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostYet another Rogue ‘Proof by Verbosity’ argument, with carefully selected quotes strung together to make your case seem overwhelming. But you are conflating political victories in retaining abortion rights (against the opposition of judgemental people like you) with personal feelings of women who choose to terminate pregnancies. Women do not generally speaking go around celebrating the termination of their fetus. It is a difficult decision for just about any woman to make. Sympathy for them and their difficult decisions is more appropriate than callously attacking them.Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom
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I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostWomen do not generally speaking go around celebrating the termination of their fetus.
It is a difficult decision for just about any woman to make.
Sympathy for them and their difficult decisions is more appropriate than callously attacking them.The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostDoes the mother have no rights of her own?
2) While you are pretending to be concerned about the "mother", you might consider the health of the mother after abortion...
A Study of Suffering After Abortion
The debate over the impact of abortion on mental health has been under discussion for many years. Dr. Julius Fogel, a psychiatrist and an abortionist referred to the psychological disturbance abortion caused in his own patients back in the late 80s. He said in an interview published in Wanderer magazine on April 13, 1989, “I’ve had patients who had an abortion a year or two ago...women who did the best thing at the time for themselves… but it still bothers them. Many come in…some are just mute, some hostile. Some burst out crying…there is no question in my mind that we are disturbing a life process. The trauma may sink into the unconscious and never surface in the woman’s lifetime…but a psychological price is paid. It may be alienation, it may be pushing away from human warmth, perhaps a hardening of the maternal instinct. Something happens on the deeper levels of a woman’s consciousness when she destroys a pregnancy. I know this as a psychiatrist.”
As a graduate student at the time, I was aware that the commonly held assumption was that women with mental health conditions would benefit from abortion when facing an unplanned pregnancy. Over the years, experience proved to many professional caregivers that abortion in such cases usually exacerbated distress, especially where some form of coercion existed.
This study provides some scientific support to the huge anecdotal evidence of the emotional suffering many suffer from abortion.The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Cow Poke View PostWhen my wife (and many other women) had a miscarriage before our first daughter was born, she grieved. Not because she lost "an insensate fetus without a function brain", but because she lost her baby.
Rights come with responsibilities. To claim one and dismiss the other is the height of arrogance.“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostA personal tragedy no doubt and one with which I have reason to identify.
This doesn't alter the reality that that during the first trimester, when virtually all terminations occur, the embryo/fetus is insensate and has no functioning brain.
2) So, you're against ALL abortions after the first trimester?
What are the rights of the mother?
Does she have any in your judgemental scenario
or is she getting what she deserves for her reckless promiscuity. What about abortion under such conditions as rape, incest, clear evidence of severe fetal deformity, and carefully ascertained evidence of the likelihood of damage to the emotional, mental, and physical health of the mother?The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
A) You realize that last part pretty well describes you, yes? (Kidding, Tass)
2) So, you're against ALL abortions after the first trimester?
The case created the "trimester" system that:
Gives American women an absolute right to an abortion in the first three months of pregnancy
allows some government regulation in the second trimester of pregnancy
declares that states may restrict or ban abortions in the last trimester as the foetus nears the point where it could live outside the womb; in this trimester a woman can obtain an abortion despite any legal ban only if doctors certify it is necessary to save her life or health.“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.
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Originally posted by rogue06 View PostEven if you don't accept that life begins at conception, the fact that there is both a heartbeat (between 5˝ and 7 weeks) and brain activity (6 to 6˝ weeks) indicates that at 12 weeks they are snuffing out a life
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