Mike Pence on how presidents should behave

[Charles]

This is called an opinion.

Yep. The same goes for pretty much of what goes on at tweb if you have not noted.

If you disagree with the particular opinion feel free to tell us why.

[Cow Poke]

Yep. The same goes for pretty much of what goes on at tweb if you have not noted.

If you disagree with the particular opinion feel free to tell us why.

"us"? You're somebody's spokesman?

And I already told why.

[JimL]

I don't know about you, but I've been cynical about politics for most of my adult life. I agree, the President should tell the truth. However, I find it massively hypocritical that the fine folks you've linked to are suddenly all angsty about it after having turned a blind eye to the last administration and Trump's primary opponent for exactly the same thing.

Yeah, because the Obama administration was just so corrupt, right. Not! You people really have lost all credibility with your continued defense of treasonous Trump and his gang of theives and the false equivalence that you attribute to Obama and Clinton.

[Psychic Missile]

That's nuttier than a fruitcake.

You don't think people make business relationships, progress in their career, or even just do their work by meeting with people one on one? Have you ever had a job?

In other words, you made it up and cannot support it.

What is the support for the idea that false rumors of infidelity hurt careers because of men spending time with someone who isn't their spouse? There are politicians who have actually cheated on their spouse and had no issue. One of them is President.

That's a really weird way of putting it -- the possibility of a false accusation is minimized by such a policy, but it's not the sole reason it's done.

How can you know if something that doesn't happen often happens less because of any given policy?

[Psychic Missile]

That’s a great bald assertion that I don’t think you can prove and just seem to believe it because your ideology tells you to. I follow the same ideals with the men I work with too. Am I too harming their careers or am I protecting the integrity of my subordinates and supervisors to keep roomers and improper conduct to a minimum? Careers are destroyed by sexual misconduct and it doesn’t take many false roomers to spread to undermine a supervisor or even get them fired by perception of improper sexual conduct. This tells me you have no a clue how to run a work center and the importance of not giving others reasons to doubt your decisions.

If you are a supervisor or manager and there are few or no other supervisors or managers in the same position it is likely you harm any male subordinates and your company is susceptible to a sexual discrimination lawsuit. If you can't be alone with a subordinate for a few minutes while they discuss some work matter with you without you sexually assaulting them or having a relationship against company policy, you should not be in that role. If someone is spreading rumors, they are displaying improper conduct and should be disciplined via company policy. Evidence is not required for anyone to start a rumor, and often rumors are started without any evidence at all.

That’s a good strawman you constructed, but you have no clue how to run a shop as this post shows. Do you have any evidence of harmed careers because I can point out lots of runioned careers based upon sexual misconduct or even roomers of sexual misconduct. Kinda hard to be accused of ‘sleeping my way to the top’ when I am never alone in a room with a male supervisor or commander, isn’t it?

I would love for you to point out all the ruined careers based on a false accusation of sexual misconduct that warrant having the policy. It is not the responsibility of women to actively avoid accusations of "sleeping their way to the top". Sexism doesn't need an excuse, it will exist regardless of the facts.

[Psychic Missile]

Oh, cut the passive-aggressive crap already. You know perfectly well what you were trying to imply.

That Pence is either worried that he will cheat on his wife, worried that he will sexually assault a woman, and/or is a sexist? I don't care to hide that at all. There's no evidence that the policy is justified, so there has to be an ulterior motive, as is commonly the case with politicians. It astounds me that certain people are all too eager to take anything someone "on their side" says at face value.

[Cow Poke]

You don't think people make business relationships, progress in their career, or even just do their work by meeting with people one on one?

That's such a stupid question.

Have you ever had a job?

And you doubled down on stupid.

[lilpixieofterror]

If you are a supervisor or manager and there are few or no other supervisors or managers in the same position it is likely you harm any male subordinates and your company is susceptible to a sexual discrimination lawsuit. If you can't be alone with a subordinate for a few minutes while they discuss some work matter with you without you sexually assaulting them or having a relationship against company policy, you should not be in that role. If someone is spreading rumors, they are displaying improper conduct and should be disciplined via company policy. Evidence is not required for anyone to start a rumor, and often rumors are started without any evidence at all.

Rumors are far harder to substainate and believe when there’s nothing to build up on. See people tend to believe things based upon what they see in front of them and well, if there’s nothing to see, why believe it? Sure you can take draconian measures and simply punish rumor starters, but that adds a believable factor to the rumor because after all, why shut people up if there’s no truth to it? Oh yeah I should note there is such thing as windows and many offices do have windows.

I would love for you to point out all the ruined careers based on a false accusation of sexual misconduct that warrant having the policy. It is not the responsibility of women to actively avoid accusations of "sleeping their way to the top". Sexism doesn't need an excuse, it will exist regardless of the facts.

You mean beyond the scalps that #metoo collected? While I love your claim that it’s not up to women to avoid accusations that’s nonsense, everyone, men and women, have a responsibility to protect themselves.

[lilpixieofterror]

That Pence is either worried that he will cheat on his wife, worried that he will sexually assault a woman, and/or is a sexist? I don't care to hide that at all. There's no evidence that the policy is justified, so there has to be an ulterior motive, as is commonly the case with politicians. It astounds me that certain people are all too eager to take anything someone "on their side" says at face value.

Assertions are the best kind of evidence and repeating it makes it double true. How many sexual scandals have brought down politicians again?

[lilpixieofterror]

That's such a stupid question.



And you doubled down on stupid.

I like how PM thinks none of us are working professionals that seem to get the job done just fine using similar guidelines.

[Tassman]

I don't know about you, but I've been cynical about politics for most of my adult life. I agree, the President should tell the truth. However, I find it massively hypocritical that the fine folks you've linked to are suddenly all angsty about it after having turned a blind eye to the last administration and Trump's primary opponent for exactly the same thing.

Yeah right, Obama was such a liar, who cheated on his wives and his administration was famously so corrupt. REALLY! I don’t think so. And Hillary was widely touted as being more of the same...a good thing IMO.

OTOH:

The entire Trump era has been a festering pit of barely disguised ongoing corruption...and that's ignoring to possible Russian collusion. The sorts of people who are apt to work for Trump seem to be those who lack much in the way of scruples...from Manafort to Scott Pruitt.

[Charles]

That Pence is either worried that he will cheat on his wife, worried that he will sexually assault a woman, and/or is a sexist? I don't care to hide that at all. [...]

Donald Trump is a bit less worried. He said the following about his own daughter:

“Yeah, she’s really something, and what a beauty, that one. If I weren’t happily married and, ya know, her father . . . ” https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...ugh-guy-41447/

[Charles]

I don't know about you, but I've been cynical about politics for most of my adult life. I agree, the President should tell the truth. However, I find it massively hypocritical that the fine folks you've linked to are suddenly all angsty about it after having turned a blind eye to the last administration and Trump's primary opponent for exactly the same thing.

I think you missed a very basic point in what was said. What is going on now does not compare to what has been going on earlier:

But the shamelessness of this administration, the dishonesty, the total indifference to facts, is something I haven’t seen before — at least not this blatant. I think it’s demoralized people and made them even more cynical about politics.

Note the "something I haven’t seen before — at least not this blatant." And try with something better than whataboutism.

[Cow Poke]

I like how PM thinks none of us are working professionals that seem to get the job done just fine using similar guidelines.

I think these liberal men treat women the same way they treat minorities - they think they're not smart enough to function in society, so they have to constantly be coming to their aid and thinking for them.

I can't think of any other reason they have to get all upset that a gentleman chooses to be a gentleman.

[Cow Poke]

Yeah right, Obama was such a liar, who cheated on his wives and his administration was famously so corrupt. REALLY! I don’t think so. And Hillary was widely touted as being more of the same...a good thing IMO.

Obama was a much more refined liar, to be sure, and much more polished in his egocentricity.